Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos • Hacker News Board

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#21

Post by baddox » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:51 PM UTC

hombre_fatal wrote: post #2

>On Sunday, Matt Watson, a video blogger, posted a 20-minute clip detailing how comments on YouTube were used to identify certain videos in which young girls were in activities that could be construed as sexually suggestive, such as posing in front of a mirror and doing gymnastics. I looked at some of the videos that appeared in his report and it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my ow…

> it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my own sisters would shoot with our dad's camcorder.

Your family camcorder videos probably weren't made available for checkout at the public library, filed under "young girls doing gymnastics" in the library's card catalog. If they were, I imagine your family and many members of the public would be creeped out or upset.

> but what else do you do here?

Require (or maybe automatically force, if implemented well) those videos to be set to Visiblity: Unlisted. I don't think anyone would be upset with sharing these links with family.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#22

Post by ravenstine » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:53 PM UTC

malvosenior wrote: post #7

hombre_fatal wrote: post #2

>On Sunday, Matt Watson, a video blogger, posted a 20-minute clip detailing how comments on YouTube were used to identify certain videos in which young girls were in activities that could be construed as sexually suggestive, such as posing in front of a mirror and doing gymnastics. I looked at some of the videos that appeared in his report and it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my ow…

I don't think Youtube can or should do much of anything here, but why on earth as a parent would you let your child upload something like that to a public website (or even worse, upload it yourself)? There are a ton of weirdo creeps out there and putting your child's private videos on Youtube of all places seems like terrible parenting.

Actually instilling morals and enforcing boundaries as a parent is an unpopular opinion these days.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#23

Post by minimaxir » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:53 PM UTC

post_break wrote: post #15

YouTube only seems to do something when it's a controversy and Ad dollars are on the line. Putting out fire after fire I don't know how the CEO keeps her job. Daddyofive, weird children ASMR, elsa-gate, algorithm being 2 clicks away from weird obscure kid videos.

That is why tech journalism is very important!

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#24

Post by gyrgtyn » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:53 PM UTC

hombre_fatal wrote: post #16

minimaxir wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but what else do you do here? For your example ("the same kind of videos my own sisters would shoot with our dad's camcorder") there are two remedies: 1) Upload the video as unlisted, so it will not appear in recommendation systems and you can send the link to your friends/family. 2) Disable comments on the video. Public content is a bit more dangerous to leave unchecked in 2019 than in 2009.

Sure, but that's an uploader's decision they can already make today. It didn't prevent this drama. The suggestion here is that Youtube should do something about it, and I'm asking what that solution specifically looks like.

Better defaults

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#25

Post by Sendotsh » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:54 PM UTC

malvosenior wrote: post #7

hombre_fatal wrote: post #2

>On Sunday, Matt Watson, a video blogger, posted a 20-minute clip detailing how comments on YouTube were used to identify certain videos in which young girls were in activities that could be construed as sexually suggestive, such as posing in front of a mirror and doing gymnastics. I looked at some of the videos that appeared in his report and it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my ow…

I don't think Youtube can or should do much of anything here, but why on earth as a parent would you let your child upload something like that to a public website (or even worse, upload it yourself)? There are a ton of weirdo creeps out there and putting your child's private videos on Youtube of all places seems like terrible parenting.

I actually think it might be technical naivety? Eg families know that you can share videos on YouTube, so they want to share their family videos to other friends and family, and don't understand permission settings and other such intricacies.

Like most people here likely do, I run tech support for my entire extended family, and a very very common theme is trying to share photos/video with family and friends.

Apple locks down iCloud so it's only easy to share with other iDevice users, and YouTube makes it REALLY easy to initially upload a video (drag onto this box, or just share from your phone/tablet video browser) but then doesn't clearly explain the different options in the processing screen, etc etc.

They also don't understand the repurcussions. They're not on reddit reading about Elsagate, they're not aware of the deep seedy underbelly of the Interwebs outside of "people buy drugs on the darknet" because they saw it on the 7:30 Report. They think the Internet is Facebook, Google, YouTube, and Amazon.

It's extremely easy for technically proficient people to underestimate how complicated and overwhelming these "simple" (for us) tasks can be to non-techies.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#26

Post by xxpor » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:55 PM UTC

post_break wrote: post #15

YouTube only seems to do something when it's a controversy and Ad dollars are on the line. Putting out fire after fire I don't know how the CEO keeps her job. Daddyofive, weird children ASMR, elsa-gate, algorithm being 2 clicks away from weird obscure kid videos.

>YouTube only seems to do something when it's a controversy and Ad dollars are on the line

"Humans respond to incentives" isn't really surprising IMO.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#27

Post by minikites » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:55 PM UTC

hombre_fatal wrote: post #16

minimaxir wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but what else do you do here? For your example ("the same kind of videos my own sisters would shoot with our dad's camcorder") there are two remedies: 1) Upload the video as unlisted, so it will not appear in recommendation systems and you can send the link to your friends/family. 2) Disable comments on the video. Public content is a bit more dangerous to leave unchecked in 2019 than in 2009.

Sure, but that's an uploader's decision they can already make today. It didn't prevent this drama. The suggestion here is that Youtube should do something about it, and I'm asking what that solution specifically looks like.

Cooperate with the authorities to find and investigate people who post creepy comments? You already can't post bomb threats online without getting an investigation.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#28

Post by pedrocx486 » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:56 PM UTC

post_break wrote: post #15

YouTube only seems to do something when it's a controversy and Ad dollars are on the line. Putting out fire after fire I don't know how the CEO keeps her job. Daddyofive, weird children ASMR, elsa-gate, algorithm being 2 clicks away from weird obscure kid videos.

Worth mentioning PayMoneyWubby and his quest to find and show weird sh*t. It's plain crazy what YouTube hosts and some people barely know about.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#29

Post by pgrote » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:57 PM UTC

jerf wrote: post #19

hombre_fatal wrote: post #2

>On Sunday, Matt Watson, a video blogger, posted a 20-minute clip detailing how comments on YouTube were used to identify certain videos in which young girls were in activities that could be construed as sexually suggestive, such as posing in front of a mirror and doing gymnastics. I looked at some of the videos that appeared in his report and it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my ow…

"Ban kids uploading a video of their innocent pool party because some creeps might enjoy it?" Given everything else YouTube already does, I seriously, no sarcasm, don't see this as a particularly problematic solution. As ceejayoz pointed out, there's some thorny consent issues involved here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19209766 (ceejayoz' point isn't much larger than my summary of it, but I wanted to give cr…

I upload unlisted videos to share with family. I batch and upload them on a monthly basis. Never had an issue with Youtube and my family videos. Last month one video was my daughter fully clothed in the bathroom dumping a cup of water on my son in the bathtub and both laughing. You could only see his head and chest. It was 10 seconds long and funny play between young siblings.

It was instantly and automatically flagged, removed and a strike placed against me for going against community guidelines. I had 40 characters to appeal, but it is automated since the response was instantaneous. There are other videos of kids dumping water on each other ... even when both are in the tub. An email asking what guideline I violated to youtube support has gone unanswered.

To me, if Youtube is automatically, instantly flagging my video, there is no reason they cannot automatically flag and remove the videos in Matt Watson's video, especially if they are public and are attracting a wide range of comments.

Don't get me wrong, it's Youtube's pool, so their rules. They can choose the content they want.

Re: Nestle, Disney Pull YouTube Ads, Joining Furor Over Child Videos

#30

Post by shittyadmin » Wed, Feb 20, 2019, 9:58 PM UTC

minimaxir wrote: post #11

hombre_fatal wrote: post #2

>On Sunday, Matt Watson, a video blogger, posted a 20-minute clip detailing how comments on YouTube were used to identify certain videos in which young girls were in activities that could be construed as sexually suggestive, such as posing in front of a mirror and doing gymnastics. I looked at some of the videos that appeared in his report and it's basically family videos of young girls, the same kind of videos my ow…

> but what else do you do here? For your example ("the same kind of videos my own sisters would shoot with our dad's camcorder") there are two remedies: 1) Upload the video as unlisted, so it will not appear in recommendation systems and you can send the link to your friends/family. 2) Disable comments on the video. Public content is a bit more dangerous to leave unchecked in 2019 than in 2009.

> Public content is a bit more dangerous to leave unchecked in 2019 than in 2009.

What sort of advances have happened since 2009 that would explain this?