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Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

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Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#11

Post by bambax »

Tomek_ wrote: post #6

That address field feature is a cool idea. I'd expect other browsers "copying" it soon, which would make it another item on a list entitled "Invented by Opera, popularized by others".

I don't understand what you find "cool": not showing protocol, not showing query parameters, or both?

> Parameters at the end of web addresses are visually hidden when the address field is not focused

I think those are terrible, terrible ideas; to the best of my knowledge this behavior was pioneered by Chrome and is now growing like a cancer, under the false premise that "non-technical users don't understand urls".

How are they going to ever understand them if browsers don't show it to them??!? Hiding query parameters breaks the relation between a url and its content; now all of Google is under the same "www.google.com" url: how is that "better"?

By the same principle that "young people don't understand words" let's remove all printed words and simply print books with the same cover and the same title -- they're all "books" anyway.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#12

Post by sgift »

xytop wrote: post #9
Tomek_ wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? I don't have any problems with Gmail under Opera. As for the "who downvoted" I guess it was someone who thinks that it's Google that should be blamed for most of "the problems" with Google's services under Opera. It's a browser that's very standard compliant and yet they don't even let you do such silly thing as changing background image on Google's front page (and of course it works fine if only you mask Opera…

Let me disagree here. Although Opera is positioned itself as standard compliant, it has many issues with javascript. Some functions are working incorrectly, some just not working, some events firing, some not. Right click is disabled too.. I'm not against Opera, but we should think about stuffs above. Regarding Google - google making their money from adverts, from people who using google. Do you really think that goo…

Your argumentation ignores that Google had to invest money to test for another browser, which may be more than the money they can make on adverts to Opera users. This has nothing to do with any supposed problems in Operas js handling (which I've never noted ... for me the js works just fine in Opera and disallowing js to handle the right mouse button is a great feature), but is a simple cost-benefit analysis.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#13

Post by nodata »

pornel wrote: post #7
Tomek_ wrote: post #6

That address field feature is a cool idea. I'd expect other browsers "copying" it soon, which would make it another item on a list entitled "Invented by Opera, popularized by others".

The way Opera hides http:// is a nice touch (edit: because they avoided copy&paste problem that Chrome has) , but such addressbar style has been pioneered by Firefox (extensions) and Chrome.

It's not. It breaks copy and paste.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#14

Post by sgift »

bambax wrote: post #11
Tomek_ wrote: post #6

That address field feature is a cool idea. I'd expect other browsers "copying" it soon, which would make it another item on a list entitled "Invented by Opera, popularized by others".

I don't understand what you find "cool": not showing protocol, not showing query parameters, or both? > Parameters at the end of web addresses are visually hidden when the address field is not focused I think those are terrible, terrible ideas; to the best of my knowledge this behavior was pioneered by Chrome and is now growing like a cancer, under the false premise that "non-technical users don't understand urls". H…

This feature evokes unpleasant memories of Microsofts decision to hide file extensions and all the pain which came because of this. The only good news is that you can deactivate the feature in your preferences.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#15

Post by balakk »

nodata wrote: post #13
pornel wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way Opera hides http:// is a nice touch (edit: because they avoided copy&paste problem that Chrome has) , but such addressbar style has been pioneered by Firefox (extensions) and Chrome.

It's not. It breaks copy and paste.

Have you tried it? it doesn't.. when the focus is on the address bar it reverts to the whole URL.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#16

Post by andrewl-hn »

sgift wrote: post #12
xytop wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me disagree here. Although Opera is positioned itself as standard compliant, it has many issues with javascript. Some functions are working incorrectly, some just not working, some events firing, some not. Right click is disabled too.. I'm not against Opera, but we should think about stuffs above. Regarding Google - google making their money from adverts, from people who using google. Do you really think that goo…

Your argumentation ignores that Google had to invest money to test for another browser, which may be more than the money they can make on adverts to Opera users. This has nothing to do with any supposed problems in Operas js handling (which I've never noted ... for me the js works just fine in Opera and disallowing js to handle the right mouse button is a great feature), but is a simple cost-benefit analysis.

Google preemptively tries to kick Opera out of the browser world. Many new services come up with dedicated code to block Opera claiming that this browser can't handle them. I can't tell you how many times I changed Opera's UA string to Firefox and those services start working. Magic! Not testing for a particular browser is fine (and truth be told Opera just works in 99.99% of the time). Blocking it just because one can is pure evil!

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#17

Post by lars »

xytop wrote: post #9
Tomek_ wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? I don't have any problems with Gmail under Opera. As for the "who downvoted" I guess it was someone who thinks that it's Google that should be blamed for most of "the problems" with Google's services under Opera. It's a browser that's very standard compliant and yet they don't even let you do such silly thing as changing background image on Google's front page (and of course it works fine if only you mask Opera…

Let me disagree here. Although Opera is positioned itself as standard compliant, it has many issues with javascript. Some functions are working incorrectly, some just not working, some events firing, some not. Right click is disabled too.. I'm not against Opera, but we should think about stuffs above. Regarding Google - google making their money from adverts, from people who using google. Do you really think that goo…

> Do you really think that google could deliberately disable Opera support due to some internal polytics and renounce from money of many opera users?

Yes. Google Docs officially does not support Opera. Not Gmail either. This was a policy change that happened some time ago.

Sources: http://docs.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answe... http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answe...

In my experience, both of these always work in Opera though, if you actually try.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#18

Post by trezor »

sgift wrote: post #14
bambax wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what you find "cool": not showing protocol, not showing query parameters, or both? > Parameters at the end of web addresses are visually hidden when the address field is not focused I think those are terrible, terrible ideas; to the best of my knowledge this behavior was pioneered by Chrome and is now growing like a cancer, under the false premise that "non-technical users don't understand urls". H…

This feature evokes unpleasant memories of Microsofts decision to hide file extensions and all the pain which came because of this. The only good news is that you can deactivate the feature in your preferences.

Too bad you can't do that in Chrome.

Re: Opera 11 - new and improved (Alpha)

#19

Post by rimantas »

I am a Mac user and I have a new wish: browser vendors releasing alpha and beta versions named as such: so instead of Opera I would have Opera11a in .dmg. Then I would simply drag it into my Application. Now I drag it on desktop, rename, and drag into Applications…
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