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Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

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Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately it's not proven; nor is it completely risk-free. But let's assume it was, I don't think ethics ever came into question when making substances illegal.

Depends on the drug. Testosterone is very well studied and has been for decades.

There is still a huge lack of information regarding long term (or even short term) exogenous Testosterone usage - and again, it's definitely not without risks or unforeseen circumstances - this is for both low and high dosages.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#52
post #24
post #5

From Wikipedia's description of muscle memory: > When a movement is repeated over time, a long-term muscle memory is created for that task, eventually allowing it to be performed without conscious effort. But this article is about enhanced muscle recovery and volume, not about motor learning. I wonder if that's an abuse of the term "muscle memory" or just a different sense. I'm not finding that sense used in a quick…

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

Source? This is very interesting

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#53
post #24
post #5

From Wikipedia's description of muscle memory: > When a movement is repeated over time, a long-term muscle memory is created for that task, eventually allowing it to be performed without conscious effort. But this article is about enhanced muscle recovery and volume, not about motor learning. I wonder if that's an abuse of the term "muscle memory" or just a different sense. I'm not finding that sense used in a quick…

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

While your second sentence is definitely true, I disagree with your first. Developing muscle strength is partially caused by training your nerves to better engage your muscle fibers; however, simply adding fibers aka raw muscle mass is the other main component of gaining strength. I would argue it's the predominant factor.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#54
post #38
post #31

Here's an interesting question. If it's proven that there are long term benefits to moderate steroid use, is it ethical to ban them for non competitive athletes?

Unless I'm misunderstanding, I don't think steroids are banned for non-competitive athletes. Who would test them and why? They're not competing anywhere.

lol they are illegal... they are banned for citizens by the government.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#55
post #24
post #5

From Wikipedia's description of muscle memory: > When a movement is repeated over time, a long-term muscle memory is created for that task, eventually allowing it to be performed without conscious effort. But this article is about enhanced muscle recovery and volume, not about motor learning. I wonder if that's an abuse of the term "muscle memory" or just a different sense. I'm not finding that sense used in a quick…

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

If I'm not mistaken, muscle fibers can only fire maximally--a muscle fiber either fires (maximally) or it doesn't fire. Isn't muscle fiber recruitment what differentiates delicate, precise motions from gross, explosive motions?

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#56
post #53
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

While your second sentence is definitely true, I disagree with your first. Developing muscle strength is partially caused by training your nerves to better engage your muscle fibers; however, simply adding fibers aka raw muscle mass is the other main component of gaining strength. I would argue it's the predominant factor.

You're both right. Improved muscle fiber recruitment is the primary way beginners gain strength. This is a fairly fast process, but plateaus off quickly. After the so-called "noob gains" are through, growing more muscle is the primary way to gain strength.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#57
post #38
post #31

Here's an interesting question. If it's proven that there are long term benefits to moderate steroid use, is it ethical to ban them for non competitive athletes?

Unless I'm misunderstanding, I don't think steroids are banned for non-competitive athletes. Who would test them and why? They're not competing anywhere.

As a manner of speaking, the word “banned” indicates a rule forbidding use in formal competition, under penalty of disqualification.

But, in the medical sense, there are a number of layers that restrict access to substances, even over the counter drugs are subject to regulation and laws, as well as prescription drugs, research chemicals, known toxins, and hazardous chemicals. All for many different reasons.

The class of anabolic steroids that body builders and weight lifters use are definitely going to land you in jail if you have them or provide them to a peer.

It doesn’t mean they are completely unavailable, but really, they are almost entirely outlawed to the same degree as crack, meth and so many other drugs around the world. Often veterinarians are the black or grey market source.

They cause harm, to the point of leaving behind a wake of debilitating destruction among the lives of users, causing awful damage that emerges later, in ruinously subtle ways, or suddenly killing without warning, by way of cardiac problems or strokes.

People use them, the results can be frightening and permanent, and a few years later, deadly.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#58
post #55
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

If I'm not mistaken, muscle fibers can only fire maximally--a muscle fiber either fires (maximally) or it doesn't fire. Isn't muscle fiber recruitment what differentiates delicate, precise motions from gross, explosive motions?

[deleted]

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a competitive athlete, I value a fair playing field. I don't want the winner to be the one with the best scientific team behind them. That just becomes a race to spend more than anyone else and also happens to leave a trail of damaged or dead athletes. It would be totally de-motivating if I thought everybody was doping and it was just the best doper who wins.

I fully respect this view towards athletic competition. But to what extent do you think this is the case now (even if we assume drug testing catches the cheats perfectly)? I'd struggle to believe that a person could succeed in, say, an Olympic athletics event without a top-quality nutritionist and team of trainers, probably including in-depth analysis of their biomechanical patterns and minute adjustments they need t…

There are exceptions to the rule though, Donald Thomas jumped higher at his 7th attempt at high jumping as a basketball player (not measuring his run-up, shoes without spikes, arms behind back to land on the mat as if breaking his fall), than years later at the olympics. Sometimes natural talent beats all the science of the world.

Re: Muscle memory discovery ends 'use it or lose it' dogma

#60
post #55
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developing muscle strength is mostly about training and growing the nerves in your muscles to engage more muscle cells when they fire. If your muscles could fire maximally they'd be strong enough to rip tendon from bone.

If I'm not mistaken, muscle fibers can only fire maximally--a muscle fiber either fires (maximally) or it doesn't fire. Isn't muscle fiber recruitment what differentiates delicate, precise motions from gross, explosive motions?

Yes and no. Individual fibers are either On or Off, but individual fibers are grouped into bundles, and any one muscle is composed of many bundles. When you flex a muscle to move a thing, your brain only recruits some of the bundles. The exact amount is determined by some combination of your willpower, focus, training level, and adrenaline.

As you train (that is, try really hard to lift something heavy), you teach your brain that you're going to be lifting heavy things a lot going forward, which makes your brain recruit more muscle fibers when you actually go ahead and lift the thing.

So you're right in one sense, and incomplete in another.

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