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The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

nytimes.com

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Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#11

Post by ForHackernews »

arcanus wrote: post #2

This all speaks to a calcification of opportunity in the USA where coming from a good family background (with strong educational opportunities) means opportunities abound. If you come from a disadvantaged background, you are likely to stay there. This is essentially meritocratic feudalism.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/06/the-hoa...

> They then pass those advantages onto their children, with parents placing a “glass floor” under their kids. They ensure they grow up in nice zip codes, provide social connections that make a difference when entering the labor force, help with internships, aid with tuition and home-buying, and schmooze with college admissions officers. All the while, they support policies and practices that protect their economic position and prevent poorer kids from climbing the income ladder: legacy admissions, the preferential tax treatment of investment income, 529 college savings plans, exclusionary zoning, occupational licensing, and restrictions on the immigration of white-collar professionals.

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#12

Post by mc32 »

inscionent wrote: post #9
sct202 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The current city = Blue and rural = Red division is a relatively recent one; so across the timescale of people born in the 80s to now you'd have a lot of political shifts that would be hard to account for. Just look at the 1996 election results by county seems unimaginable now, but it wasn't that long ago. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_United_States_presidentia...

If you are going to use the 1996 county map you need to factor out Perot. Louisiana for example is much bluer Parish by Parish in 1996 than any of the elections going back to 1980.

I think Perot was ‘92, no? There, yes, like Nader after him was a “spoiler” as the losers like to call them.

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#13

Post by danharaj »

hash872 wrote: post #8
DataWorker wrote: post #3

This seems like an obvious consequence of globalism and the nature of the labor market. Also seems consistent with Picketty’s thesis about capital growth. The days when being a US citizen gauranteed affluence are coming to a close. To see the future look at California; refugees from Guatemala living amongst young millionaires, mostly immigrants also. A global community, sliced into ever narrower tranches by the invis…

Much of Piketty's work has been widely debunked, especially r > g, so I'm not sure why one would start with his thesis. Top 1% income earners are typically business founder-owners, and reams of evidence from the Forbes 400 to tax data show that the wealthiest in US society are entrepreneurs who again created their own business- not rentiers living off of inherited wealth. (Anecdotally, children of inherited wealth th…

> Much of Piketty's work has been widely debunked, especially r > g

Big claim.

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#14

Post by Bucephalus355 »

I’m not sure what the motive is of this piece. Are we going to tax more the most opioid ravaged parts of Ohio to pay for the poor in New York City?

Poverty today is closely linked with housing prices. If your housing is too expensive, it’s up to fix it (looking at you California).

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#15

Post by hash872 »

therealforsen wrote: post #10
hash872 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of Piketty's work has been widely debunked, especially r > g, so I'm not sure why one would start with his thesis. Top 1% income earners are typically business founder-owners, and reams of evidence from the Forbes 400 to tax data show that the wealthiest in US society are entrepreneurs who again created their own business- not rentiers living off of inherited wealth. (Anecdotally, children of inherited wealth th…

i think by globalism he means that free trade brings with it the free movement of labor across countries >what type of alternate reality could exist where foreigners would be polite enough to not, like, turn a wrench or run an assembly line for cheaper than Americans did in the 50s. We as a country don't have the option of 'choosing' an alternate economic reality where developing country wages aren't cheaper than our…

Manufacturing jobs were leaving the US in the millions pre-NAFTA and China joining the WTO. Even with high tariffs & restrictionist immigration policies, it can't change the fact that someone in a 3rd world country can do x semi-skilled labor for $2 an hour whereas a unionized American does it for $30+. You can't pass a law against cheaper.

Even with the highest tariffs in the world, manufacturers would still have left for cheaper labor elsewhere in a globalized world. Economic reality is not a choice

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#16

Post by pytester »

hash872 wrote: post #15
therealforsen wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think by globalism he means that free trade brings with it the free movement of labor across countries >what type of alternate reality could exist where foreigners would be polite enough to not, like, turn a wrench or run an assembly line for cheaper than Americans did in the 50s. We as a country don't have the option of 'choosing' an alternate economic reality where developing country wages aren't cheaper than our…

Manufacturing jobs were leaving the US in the millions pre-NAFTA and China joining the WTO. Even with high tariffs & restrictionist immigration policies, it can't change the fact that someone in a 3rd world country can do x semi-skilled labor for $2 an hour whereas a unionized American does it for $30+. You can't pass a law against cheaper. Even with the highest tariffs in the world, manufacturers would still have le…

>You can't pass a law against cheaper.

Tariffs, especially combined with the usually underestimated coordination expense of managing supply chains across continents, can make cheaper not cheaper.

>Economic reality is not a choice

It is completely a choice. Unfettered trade, globalism and the Washington Consensus were all choices.

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#17

Post by [deleted] »

Bucephalus355 wrote: post #14

I’m not sure what the motive is of this piece. Are we going to tax more the most opioid ravaged parts of Ohio to pay for the poor in New York City? Poverty today is closely linked with housing prices. If your housing is too expensive, it’s up to fix it (looking at you California).

[deleted]

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#18

Post by peterhadlaw »

danharaj wrote: post #13
hash872 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of Piketty's work has been widely debunked, especially r > g, so I'm not sure why one would start with his thesis. Top 1% income earners are typically business founder-owners, and reams of evidence from the Forbes 400 to tax data show that the wealthiest in US society are entrepreneurs who again created their own business- not rentiers living off of inherited wealth. (Anecdotally, children of inherited wealth th…

> Much of Piketty's work has been widely debunked, especially r > g Big claim.

This book was a great read and I highly recommend it for anyone who wants a little more perspective on Piketty's work: https://campus.aynrand.org/works/2015/10/09/equal-is-unfair

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#19

Post by vivism »

"Within the same state or metropolitan area, inequality today is large and extreme, in part because of the continuing effects of racial discrimination"

What is the ratio of discrimination to starting from a historically disadvantaged (i.e. non-recompensed) position?

This article reads like a narrated census rather than a true insight into the problem.

Re: The Biggest Economic Divides Aren’t Regional, They’re Local

#20

Post by hash872 »

ForHackernews wrote: post #11
arcanus wrote: post #2

This all speaks to a calcification of opportunity in the USA where coming from a good family background (with strong educational opportunities) means opportunities abound. If you come from a disadvantaged background, you are likely to stay there. This is essentially meritocratic feudalism.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/06/the-hoa... > They then pass those advantages onto their children, with parents placing a “glass floor” under their kids. They ensure they grow up in nice zip codes, provide social connections that make a difference when entering the labor force, help with internships, aid with tuition and home-buying, and schmooze with college admissions officers. All the while, th…

The belief system here makes me incredulous. How exactly does the average upper middle class worker support 'occupational licensing' and 'restrictions on the immigration of white-collar professionals'? Can you outline the exact steps that they've taken to, say, support occupational licensing? When did a pro-occupational licensing candidate run for office? The latter is especially ironic because so many people believe the opposite, that the US has supported the H1B and other visa programs to drive down programmer wages.

While I agree that superior education etc. absolutely helps the children of the upper middle class, the 'social connections' part is pure fantasy. The vast majority of regular people secure employment based on actual credentials and not 'connections', especially in tech

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