Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#871

Post by EGreg » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 3:50 AM UTC

Good. Why do the good people of NYC need to be taxed just so their taxes can be given as corporate welfare to a large corporation that will then come and organize other New Yorkers’ activities in such a way that money is siphoned out of the city?

If we want to create jobs, we don’t need a giant corporation using our tax money to help organize this human activity. We can hire each other for our own local purposes.

If we want to keep NYC rich then we don’t exploit the labor of the local population to send money out of the city.

The biggest US export by far is Dollars, ever since Bretton Woods they are in demand all around the world. We trade them for stuff others make. It has made Americans lazy and fat.

Do you really want jobs? Like race-to-the-bottom Amazon warehouse slave jobs? Is that the goal of humans? No. It’s just fed to them.

Donald Trump said he’ll keep the jobs in this country. Bernie said he’ll keep the money in this country by preventing corporations and billionaires from offshoring it through loopholes.

I know which goal I’d prefer, if I wanted Americans to be the masters and not the slaves. (I happen to believe that money going to poorer areas is good, so I don’t hold that nationalistic position - but if I did, I would want the money to stay, not jobs.)

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#872

Post by karmelapple » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 3:54 AM UTC

door5 wrote: post #859

zanny wrote: post #846

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if one of them were elected president - which, again, faces staunch resistance by the olgiarch controlled DNC - a vast majority of congress is bought and paid for by globalist interests. The Occupy Wall Street movement was probably the last possible chance to correct course. Further attempts need to somehow capture a greater mindshare than the immediate aftermath of Bush's imperialism, wanton greed and corruptio…

This is extremely fatalistic. I agree that the system is severely flawed, but your conclusion that struggle for a better country is pointless is hopeless, and is not shared by a lot of the country. for many people, political struggle is necessary . This sort of fatalism is only really a tenable position when your livelihood is not at stake.

Fully agreed. And if you don’t like the people in Congress, start volunteering for people you think are good. Or make yourself into one of those people. It’s not fast, it’s not easy, but it is possible. And fight for law changes that will help change - I would highly suggest advocating for ranked choice voting.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#873

Post by plink » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:04 AM UTC

philwelch wrote: post #835

ianleeclark wrote: post #744

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, Veganism is the easiest way of avoiding animal cruelty.

Unless you have a cat and refuse to feed it meat. That’s cruel to the cat, in my opinion. Edit: Cats are obligate carnivores and can't physically remain healthy without eating meat.

Then there's the flip side with creeps like me. I'm a plant sadist who feeds tofu to my Venus flytrap.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#874

Post by wnevets » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:06 AM UTC

rsj_hn wrote: post #825

wnevets wrote: post #690

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google already has some dev offices in cheaper areas, like Pittsburgh, where office space is cheaper and the salaries they pay slightly lower. And yet, they still choose to double their headcount in NYC. Location, Location, Location. Yes it's cheaper to live and run a business in Kansas but then you're in Kansas.

I don't want to tell you what the right trade offs are between, say, living in Phoenix or Dallas or Charleston and living in NY or SF. But at some point people want to start families and buy a house and that starts to take precedence over being in a cool area. The only issue is jobs -- can they work remote, can they find a local employer, can they work for themselves? So there is a huge demand for higher paying jobs…

>So there is a huge demand for higher paying jobs in lower cost areas compared to the demand for higher paying jobs in higher cost areas

NYC is the most populated and density populated city in the country, which is just another way of saying its the city with the highest demand. If most people rather work and live in Scottsdale than that would be the most populated and density populated city in the country.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#875

Post by ennisthemennis » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:07 AM UTC

humanrebar wrote: post #802

JohnFen wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unless it's for a football stadium. You haven't seen the perpetual and energetic fights in my part of the nation about public funding for football (and other professional sports) stadiums. Sports businesses trying to get tax money to be spent in order to enhance their profitability is absolutely something that brings out the opposition.

Correct. St. Louis and San Diego both let pro football clubs leave recently.

It's more complicated than just St. Louis and San Diego not wanting to put up money. The owners of the respective teams wanted to move to LA pretty much no matter what, and requested particularly absurd things so they could pretend they tried

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#876

Post by zxcvbn4038 » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:08 AM UTC

Some practical considerations that nobody talks about are 1) the 7 train that would have served Amazon's HQ2 location would be hard pressed to accommodate 25,000 additional riders. The 7 train is notorious for delays whenever there is in-climate weather - for at least the past twenty years the slightest precipitation knocks out the signal system and the segment connecting to manhattan shuts down every alternate weekend and whenever the weather is in-climate for maintenance. 2) housing in the area if at capacity so not sure where they think 25,000 additional people are going to live 3) schools in the area are over capacity so not sure where they think the kids of the 25,000 extra people were going to go. I've also observed that Amazon employees live in utter terror of being out of contact - I'm under the impression that missing a support call results in immediate termination - and there are numerous dead spots within the city and along commuter corridors where you will be out of contact for prolonged periods of time.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#877

Post by acjohnson55 » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:08 AM UTC

coryfklein wrote: post #288

SCAQTony wrote: post #208

Hey, remember those Amazon insiders that bought property on the cheap? "...Amazon employees are apparently eager to get a head start on the New York City real estate game. Condo sales in Long Island City are soaring following the announcement that the Queens, New York, [a] neighborhood will host part of Amazon's HQ2, The Wall Street Journal reports. According to The Journal, one brokerage firm sold 150 units in four…

That was my first thought on seeing the headline as well. However I think those buyers will still do just fine. I doubt very many people have lost money by investing in NYC real estate.

Depends if they can hold. A lot of speculators are going to have to take an L if they thought they were going to flip as Amazon ramped up. Especially if they took debt to do so.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#878

Post by acjohnson55 » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:10 AM UTC

hnarn wrote: post #242

SCAQTony wrote: post #208

Hey, remember those Amazon insiders that bought property on the cheap? "...Amazon employees are apparently eager to get a head start on the New York City real estate game. Condo sales in Long Island City are soaring following the announcement that the Queens, New York, [a] neighborhood will host part of Amazon's HQ2, The Wall Street Journal reports. According to The Journal, one brokerage firm sold 150 units in four…

It rarely happens, but it's always refreshing to see when real estate investment doesn't just equal free money.

It happens pretty often, actually. It's a myth that real estate is some kind of money printing machine.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#879

Post by peteretep » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:15 AM UTC

samstave wrote: post #756

siruncledrew wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon's spectacle reminds me of Lebron's "The Decision". It's one thing to work out the details and make an announcement, but to purposefully turn it into a show about "What can you do for me?" instead of "Here's what I can do for you" made it not sit well with people. Also, the pull-out letter also basically dumps the blame on state/local officials for not wanting Amazon, despite not all stakeholders being present…

I am announcing an exploratory committee on whether or not I may or may not Apply for YCS19 - I wont tell you if I will apply or not - or how much money my [stealth] startup-unicorn will attempt to raise for an innovative and world-changing product we have yet to decide on seeking a co-founder for. But I am telling you now that I am planning on letting you know, at the end of this quarter - or maybe next month or who…

> #YCFundMeToo

YC Fund "Me Too" -- I think you might want to let PR and HR take a look at this before you move forward with this name.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#880

Post by darpa_escapee » Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 4:20 AM UTC

nova22033 wrote: post #491

munificent wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah but they will get that tax break regardless I just don't understand this argument. It's like "Someone's gonna get fucked, so I'd prefer it be me." That tax break is real money . Money that your community will not be able to spend on education, infrastructure, police, parks, all the things that make a place worth living in. Why would you hand that over to a company that doesn't need it?

>That tax break is real money. Money that your community will not be able to spend on education, infrastructure, police, parks, You run a store. You put up a sign offering a 50% discount. I walk in the store and you tell me there is no discount. I walk out. Guess what? You didn't get any money and I didn't get anything out of the deal. Amazon backing out of HQ2 doesn't mean you get to keep the money. You never had th…

Real estate is a finite resource. NYC isn't some dying rust belt town, someone will setup shop where Amazon planned to, and they will pay taxes that Amazon thought they shouldn't have to pay.