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Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

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Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#461

Post by qhwudbebd »

ttty wrote: post #455
qhwudbebd wrote: post #85

I note from the mention of £25k that you're probably in the UK. If you don't mind burning fifty quid or so, you might find it satisfying to use the small claims process to issue for a sensible (not super-inflated) estimate of damages. The below is not legal advice, but is written from personal experience. Try to leave a clear paper trail of your reasonableness: send a clear notice before action with a reasonable time…

But why would Google have to pay for any damages? I spoke with a lawyer about this and looks like it won't work at all. From what I understand Google doesn't have any obligation to serve his app on the play store. Unless you can prove that they are a monopoly, but to do that it's very hard and you need a lot of investigation.

The point here is not that you will win if they defend it. The point here is that you will win if they don't, and at the very least cost them significant non-reclaimable money if they do.

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#462

Post by falsedan »

mcguire wrote: post #341
avip wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So says you. This is what the ToS say: Google may terminate this Agreement with You for any reason with thirty (30) days' prior written notice. In addition, Google may, at any time, immediately suspend or terminate this Agreement with You if: (a) You have breached any provision of this Agreement, any non-disclosure agreement or other agreement relating to Google Play or the Android platform; (b) Google is required to…

Have those TOS been validated through the courts?

They’re just torts, so yes

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#464

Post by falsedan »

gambiting wrote: post #60
lovich wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Isn't this legally actionable fraud? Does it matter if it is? B2B lawsuits only get down to the actual law if the parties have a relatively equal amount of money. A small or medium business going after google _after google has shut off their revenue_ is not going to ever win

Why not? If you take them to court over this they would have to at least send a representative and that costs money - in a case like this they would almost definitely tell the engineering team to fix this specific case. Especially since this is in the UK so if Google lost they would be liable for the process fees. Maybe even small claims court would be enough, and that's 100% not worth sending a lawyer for.

> small claims court would be enough, and that's 100% not worth sending a lawyer for.

I think the UK is like the US, and you have to represent yourself in small claims (to avoid wasting the court’s time). A county judge would probably find in the claimant’s favour in 2 seconds if you sent a solicitor…

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#465

Post by solatic »

gambiting wrote: post #60
lovich wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Isn't this legally actionable fraud? Does it matter if it is? B2B lawsuits only get down to the actual law if the parties have a relatively equal amount of money. A small or medium business going after google _after google has shut off their revenue_ is not going to ever win

Why not? If you take them to court over this they would have to at least send a representative and that costs money - in a case like this they would almost definitely tell the engineering team to fix this specific case. Especially since this is in the UK so if Google lost they would be liable for the process fees. Maybe even small claims court would be enough, and that's 100% not worth sending a lawyer for.

Let's imagine for argument's sake that there's a developer account team inside Google which could pull the relevant machine levers and reinstate OP's account. OP has already talked to developer relations support managers who have proven to be unable to get the developer account team to comply. Why should a Google legal team be more successful than a developer relations support manager at getting the developer account team to comply, when Legal is almost certainly laterally farther away inside Google?

Ultimately, in-house counsel at an org the size of Google is tasked with making the problem go away. It's easier to do that by burying the opposition in machine-generated paperwork than it is to convince people laterally far away in your org to comply. As a small business, you can't afford to pay for lawyers to deal with all the paperwork, so the bigger side (Google) always wins.

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#466

Post by interpol_p »

bouke wrote: post #436
interpol_p wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know about the Google Play process but the App Store review process has been worthwhile. I’ve had many phone calls with them over the years detailing specific changes which need to be made to conform to policy. They are definitely not “low-level” employees but they are also not technically proficient. They are policy enforcers. I’ve also had reviewers push for internal change on my behalf when policy seems po…

That’s actually good advice, bur doesn’t appear to be applied to mist kids apps. All apps that I’ve come across have been litterd with ads placed in such a way to increase the possibility of the kid accidentally clicking on them. A dark grey UX pattern.

Yeah it disgusts me.

My oldest is going through apps almost entirely by jumping through ads which force you to install the next "free" game.

The reason Apple applied extra scrutiny to my app is because I checked the box indicating "Made for kids."

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#467

Post by gambiting »

smadurange wrote: post #440
gambiting wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android does offer those things. Google play store does not. They are two separate things.

Then I'm sure these guys wouldnt have to write this up. The reality of Android is you need Google's approval if you want to develop for it in a commercial capacity. The rest is just theory.

That's like saying that free market doesn't exist because you need a permission from your local council to run a business. There are other companies that have built their own stores on top of android - you are free to sell your applications there, or to make your own store. Android as an operating system does not limit where you can sell or buy apps, unlike iOS where you only get one source.

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#468

Post by hutzlibu »

zmmmmm wrote: post #149

This is awful and I feel terrible for them, but a lot of alarm bells went off when I read this: I then attempted to login to my ‘Google Developer Account’ for the first time. Previous to this our app developers were the only ones to access our account to upload and update our app for us It sounds like they violated probably one of the first requirements of the ToS not to share account credentials. From there ... real…

"Such a ban should be a last resort after many, many transgressions and a result of extensive manual review, not handed out on an automatic basis."

Surely not, but that's what happens if you manage millions of apps and developers with minimum human labour. But even if they would increase human labour ... I guess it is really hard to look into all the cases, because what do you do with (smart) malicious actors, trying to circumvent bans?

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#469

Post by tinus_hn »

hogu wrote: post #192
bdibs wrote: post #50

I actually just got my Google Ads account suspended because I forgot to update my billing address before adding a new card. The suspension was for "suspicious billing activity", tried appealing twice with the correct billing address, and was told the suspension is final (some automated email) both times. They won't take my calls because the account is suspended, which leaves me not being able to advertise on the #1 s…

I was also suspended. - Having friends inside google does not help (I suppose at some level they can, but L5/L6 engineers aren't enough) - Creating a new account with a different credit card does not help. Subsequent accounts they can link back to you will also be banned - I haven't found a solution yet, except for keeping all of my new projects outside of google (no google analytics, no google search console (which…

On the plus side, they are helping you remove your dependencies on Google! If you ever decide you’re done with them it’ll be easier to cut them out of your life.

Re: Google terminated our business via our Google Play Developer Account

#470

Post by baybal2 »

tacon wrote: post #263
gambiting wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's basically how it works. It costs you very little(couple hundred £ at most) to ask a lawyer to craft a letter to send to Google legal team saying they have to resolve the issue for you within 14 days or you will be taking them to court. And if there's one thing that's absolutely certain is that Google's law team's time is way more expensive than whatever lawyer you found to write a letter or two is going to cha…

No, Google sends a "litigation paralegal" to small claims court. But you will eventually lose: https://www.huffingtonpost.com/aaron-greenspan/why-i-sued-go... https://www.huffingtonpost.com/aaron-greenspan/why-google-bo...

Write a letter in plain language yourself, and escalate, escalate, escalate, then them being represented by a paralegal drone will begin to bite them.

Another advice: have 1 account per project, invariably of what their tos say.

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