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Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

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Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#111

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

thisisweirdok wrote: post #95
blisterpeanuts wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

28 miles per hour pretty much rules them out except for residential neighborhoods. Most major city streets in the U.S. are at least 30 mph. If the Pickman can be improved to go 40, it might stand a chance. Otherwise, it's just a glorified golf cart as the other poster suggests.

You could get by with 28 MPH in some cities. Boston for example has a 25 MPH speed limit city-wide, unless posted otherwise. It wouldn't work in some places, but I wouldn't mind using a fancy golf cart there to run errands. That Pickman truck in the article is right up my alley.

NEVs have been available for 20+ years. If you want one you can have one now.

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#112

Post by gamegoblin »

MrRadar wrote: post #101
ngngngng wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't get it. a John Deere Gator with two seats and 4 wheels, and not much else costs over $7000 new. No windows, No airbags, pathetic top speed, not road legal. A Lada 4x4 costs less than that brand new in Russia. Road legal, standard car top speed. Known as a very reliable car. Why can't I buy a really cheap car in the United States? edit: also the lada 4x4 is possibly the coolest car i've ever seen, in it's…

"Road legal" has a different standard in the US. To sell a car in the US it must have airbags, ABS, electronic stability control, a backup camera (also implying a decently-large full-color display on the dashboard), and it must meet USDOT, NHTSA, and EPA standards (each of which are slightly incompatible with standards from other regions, and intentionally so as a soft trade barrier). I'm guessing that the Lada 4x4 w…

FWIW if the car is >= 25 years old, most of these regulations go away.

I have a 1990 Subaru Sambar pickup truck [1] imported from Japan that is street legal and registered in Washington state. It’s probably only a tiny bit safer than a motorcycle because it has seatbelts. Maybe cancelled out by the fact that I don’t wear a helmet while driving it.

You can get them for $3K - 5K depending on condition and they are excellent little city trucks that get fantastic fuel economy. Getting used to the right-side drive and shifting left handed wasn’t so bad. The hard part is the blinkers and windshield wipers are swapped!

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_Sambar#/media/File%3A...

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#114

Post by dv_dt »

ngngngng wrote: post #81
dv_dt wrote: post #55

These seem like utility (landscaping) grade golf carts that are already a market in the US. Available in mostly gas, but some electric forms. https://www.deere.com/en/gator-utility-vehicles/ https://www.toro.com/en/sports-fields-municipalities/utility... https://www.catresourcecenter.com/machine/landscaping/utilit...

I just don't get it. a John Deere Gator with two seats and 4 wheels, and not much else costs over $7000 new. No windows, No airbags, pathetic top speed, not road legal. A Lada 4x4 costs less than that brand new in Russia. Road legal, standard car top speed. Known as a very reliable car. Why can't I buy a really cheap car in the United States? edit: also the lada 4x4 is possibly the coolest car i've ever seen, in it's…

With the Deere Gator, you're paying a bit more for quality, and more for brand recognition. There are very likely competitors in this same category that have both lower prices and less famous names. Sometimes higher prices for better quality is good, or at least ok overall.

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#115

Post by Digit-Al »

akshatrathi wrote: post #38
mtw wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know if they actually make a profit on a $1000 or $9000 price, or they're just dumping their products on the market, like they did for solar panels?

I don't for certain. In my trip to China, I couldn't meet makers of LSEVs. What I do know is that there are no subsidies in that market, which means carmakers won't survive if they don't make a profit. But it's a good question whether they are making that profit at the cost of human lives (no crash protection) or the environment (lead-acid batteries).

I have just had a look on Wikipedi for the list of road deaths by country [1].

The figures are from 2013, so very out of date, but for the UK (where I live) it is 5.1 road fatalaties per 100,000 motor vehicles. For the US it is 12.9, and for China 104.5. I think that shows pretty starkly that the reason we are paying so much more for our cars is for a massively higher chance of surviving an accident.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r...

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#116

Post by jamessantiago »

gamegoblin wrote: post #112
MrRadar wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Road legal" has a different standard in the US. To sell a car in the US it must have airbags, ABS, electronic stability control, a backup camera (also implying a decently-large full-color display on the dashboard), and it must meet USDOT, NHTSA, and EPA standards (each of which are slightly incompatible with standards from other regions, and intentionally so as a soft trade barrier). I'm guessing that the Lada 4x4 w…

FWIW if the car is >= 25 years old, most of these regulations go away. I have a 1990 Subaru Sambar pickup truck [1] imported from Japan that is street legal and registered in Washington state. It’s probably only a tiny bit safer than a motorcycle because it has seatbelts. Maybe cancelled out by the fact that I don’t wear a helmet while driving it. You can get them for $3K - 5K depending on condition and they are exce…

You just rekindled my long time desire to own one of these. I saw them all over the place in okinawa and I have a die-cast toy car of one somewhere around here. I remember there was someone who put that longhorn decoration you see as a texas cliche on one. They definitely are pretty neat. It would be great for hauling landscaping items from my local nursery without having to get a full sized truck.

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#117

Post by Gravityloss »

gamegoblin wrote: post #112
MrRadar wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Road legal" has a different standard in the US. To sell a car in the US it must have airbags, ABS, electronic stability control, a backup camera (also implying a decently-large full-color display on the dashboard), and it must meet USDOT, NHTSA, and EPA standards (each of which are slightly incompatible with standards from other regions, and intentionally so as a soft trade barrier). I'm guessing that the Lada 4x4 w…

FWIW if the car is >= 25 years old, most of these regulations go away. I have a 1990 Subaru Sambar pickup truck [1] imported from Japan that is street legal and registered in Washington state. It’s probably only a tiny bit safer than a motorcycle because it has seatbelts. Maybe cancelled out by the fact that I don’t wear a helmet while driving it. You can get them for $3K - 5K depending on condition and they are exce…

That's just so cool. I don't know why. It's somehow got this giant "I do what I want" attitude written on it. Muscle cars seem so conservative and formulaic.

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#118

Post by bryanlarsen »

stemc43 wrote: post #73
Someone1234 wrote: post #31

I'd technically be in the demographic for this. I have a less than 10 mile commute. However, that 28 MpH maximum speed is a legitimate limitation/problem, even on my under 10 mile commute, there's at least two roads that are 40 MpH (people drive 45 MpH), and I'm going to get honked at if I can barely maintain 28 MpH. I like the price and concept... But that max speed is a deal breaker. It will be interesting to see w…

There is no way these will be street legal in US. Just 0% chance. Selling something street legal is a huge hustle in US -> is why there is exactly 0 Chinese car manufacturers represented here (hell - no even european renault and peugeot can get established) -> just a huge lobby & big & politics & patent war stacking up against this.

Low speed vehicles with no safety equipment are street legal in most US states. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-speed_vehicle

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#119

Post by ataturk »

MrRadar wrote: post #101
ngngngng wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't get it. a John Deere Gator with two seats and 4 wheels, and not much else costs over $7000 new. No windows, No airbags, pathetic top speed, not road legal. A Lada 4x4 costs less than that brand new in Russia. Road legal, standard car top speed. Known as a very reliable car. Why can't I buy a really cheap car in the United States? edit: also the lada 4x4 is possibly the coolest car i've ever seen, in it's…

"Road legal" has a different standard in the US. To sell a car in the US it must have airbags, ABS, electronic stability control, a backup camera (also implying a decently-large full-color display on the dashboard), and it must meet USDOT, NHTSA, and EPA standards (each of which are slightly incompatible with standards from other regions, and intentionally so as a soft trade barrier). I'm guessing that the Lada 4x4 w…

Hell, soon you won't even be able to get a manual transmission vehicle anymore because of dumb laws.

Re: Cheap Chinese electric cars are coming to the US and Europe

#120

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

pier25 wrote: post #54

I'm surprised China is going straight to the first world markets. These could be a hit in developing countries like Mexico (at China prices).

Developing countries don't have reliable power delivery networks with enough reserve capacity to handle a surge in demand to charge these cars.
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