BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free • Hacker News Board

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#41

Post by randomacct3847 » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 4:45 PM UTC

esoterica wrote: post #33

randomacct3847 wrote: post #22

So called “shadow work” is becoming more prevalent. When you choose to self checkout at a grocery store you’re essentially doing work for free (scanning and bagging your own groceries) in place of a paid cashier and bagger.

When you choose to drive your own car you’re doing work for free in place of a paid driver. When you choose to do your own dishes you’re doing work for free in place of a paid housekeeper. Etc.

Not a good take. In the supermarket example you do free work to save a company money on labor. You don’t save a corporate entity anything when you drive instead of take an Uber or wash dishes instead of hiring a cleaner.

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#42

Post by fdggdfsvscvsd » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 4:51 PM UTC

bastawhiz wrote: post #20

For me, the real story here is that BF failed to take any action at all to retain a top five driver of traffic to their ad revenue - driven website. Let's say that quiz interactions from McMahon come out to 5% of ad impressions for all of BF. What would a site as big as BF pay to ensure that those 5% of impressions don't disappear overnight? At most companies, I'd imagine quite a bit. Even if we look at the low numbe…

I wonder if she would have kept up the same good work if she had been paid for it. Not meaning it in a bad way, I mean the difference of doing it for fun and doing it for money.

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#43

Post by bjterry » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 4:51 PM UTC

bastawhiz wrote: post #20

For me, the real story here is that BF failed to take any action at all to retain a top five driver of traffic to their ad revenue - driven website. Let's say that quiz interactions from McMahon come out to 5% of ad impressions for all of BF. What would a site as big as BF pay to ensure that those 5% of impressions don't disappear overnight? At most companies, I'd imagine quite a bit. Even if we look at the low numbe…

It could also be that the marginal traffic or revenue generated by her over the next best quiz author is much less than $200k. If so, having her specifically may only be worth, say, $5k and not worth the hassle in the context of the overall program continuing to work.

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#44

Post by im3w1l » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 4:57 PM UTC

pilsetnieks wrote: post #19

CM30 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, most platforms and social media sites tend to have the same business model. The only reason YouTube or Medium or Facebook or Twitter or Reddit or whatever else are financially viable is because most people are volunteering their efforts for free. Arguably the same rings true of every wiki, internet forum and community site in general. The question hence becomes 'what point does a site or service go from b…

I would say the exploitative threshold is crossed when the unpaid community members don't derive any value for themselves from the content (or maybe when the community organizer derives significantly more value from it than its users.) From wikipedia they get information, from the Stackexchange network - answers to questions that enable or improve their work or hobby; Buzzfeed's Justin Bieber haircut quizzes, however…

It's not the reader that gets exploited it's the creator? What does someone get for answering a question on stack overflow?

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#45

Post by slededit » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:00 PM UTC

bastawhiz wrote: post #35

slededit wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are sorted into different classes in companies. You’ll never get a company to pay six figures for someone they consider a free intern - regardless of whether it’s in their economic interest.

> You’ll never get a company to pay six figures for someone they consider a free intern And yet here they are, having lost that percentage of revenue because they had this mindset. I don't think she needed a six figure salary necessarily, but BF made exactly no attempt to do _anything_. Unlike an unpaid intern, McMahon could have kept doing this indefinitely, not just for three summer months.

It’s human nature, and it happens not just in business. People get up in arms whenever an open source project tries to monetize in some way other than “support”.

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#46

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:03 PM UTC

bjterry wrote: post #43

bastawhiz wrote: post #20

For me, the real story here is that BF failed to take any action at all to retain a top five driver of traffic to their ad revenue - driven website. Let's say that quiz interactions from McMahon come out to 5% of ad impressions for all of BF. What would a site as big as BF pay to ensure that those 5% of impressions don't disappear overnight? At most companies, I'd imagine quite a bit. Even if we look at the low numbe…

It could also be that the marginal traffic or revenue generated by her over the next best quiz author is much less than $200k. If so, having her specifically may only be worth, say, $5k and not worth the hassle in the context of the overall program continuing to work.

[deleted]

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#47

Post by HillaryBriss » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:06 PM UTC

im3w1l wrote: post #44

pilsetnieks wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say the exploitative threshold is crossed when the unpaid community members don't derive any value for themselves from the content (or maybe when the community organizer derives significantly more value from it than its users.) From wikipedia they get information, from the Stackexchange network - answers to questions that enable or improve their work or hobby; Buzzfeed's Justin Bieber haircut quizzes, however…

It's not the reader that gets exploited it's the creator? What does someone get for answering a question on stack overflow?

often it's just the pleasure of being ignored, or downvoted, or insulted by a newbie who wants you to do some additional free coding work. so, yeah, it's a pretty good deal

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#48

Post by owenmarshall » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:07 PM UTC

driverdan wrote: post #38

peteretep wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One would assume that in a sufficiently competitive market (for examples, certainly in the UK, supermarkets), this then gets passed on in terms of price cuts.

It gets passed on in the form of faster checkouts and shorter lines, resulting in less wasted time.

“Please place the item in the bag.”

“Please remove the last scanned item from the bag and scan it before placing it in the bag.”

“Please wait, help is on the way.”

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#49

Post by HillaryBriss » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:13 PM UTC

randomacct3847 wrote: post #22

So called “shadow work” is becoming more prevalent. When you choose to self checkout at a grocery store you’re essentially doing work for free (scanning and bagging your own groceries) in place of a paid cashier and bagger.

I think that's true, but, in some ways "work" is in the eye of the beholder.

I mean, long ago, before the invention of the department store or grocery store, the customer wasn't allowed to just roam around in the aisles grabbing products. A clerk had to go and fetch the inventory from the shelves for the customer.

Shoppers today do a tremendous amount of shadow work for the grocery store but think little of it. We actually like it.

Re: BuzzFeed’s 19-year-old quizmaker will no longer work for free

#50

Post by esoterica » Sun, Feb 03, 2019, 5:16 PM UTC

randomacct3847 wrote: post #41

esoterica wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you choose to drive your own car you’re doing work for free in place of a paid driver. When you choose to do your own dishes you’re doing work for free in place of a paid housekeeper. Etc.

Not a good take. In the supermarket example you do free work to save a company money on labor. You don’t save a corporate entity anything when you drive instead of take an Uber or wash dishes instead of hiring a cleaner.

When you drive to work you’re saving your company money by providing free labor since they don’t have to hire someone to drive you to work.