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Sex censorship killed the internet we love

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Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#441

Post by marcus_holmes »

StevePerkins wrote: post #430
bleb wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

did they say american hegemony began post-9/11 or that google's biases are deliberate? those claims would certainly be ridiculous. i think you may have a point but i'm not clear on it. you're saying that there are other factors besides US cultural hegemony which would've contributed to the shift in sweden's media norms?

We are in a sub-thread, about Sweden's changing trends in censorship over the past 10-20 years . To claim that American hegemony is the cause, one must claim that American hegemony grew drastically stronger in that timeframe (a.k.a. the 9/11 era). Put differently... you have to claim that the Marshall Plan and a half-century of Hollywood exports had no effect, but YouTube and Facebook did cause a reversal. I think yo…

or the gradual buildup of US influence of cultural media norms reached a tipping point over the last 10-20 years and it became more acceptable to watch a murder than to watch sex in Sweden. These things take time, and generations, to shift attitudes.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#442

Post by marcus_holmes »

brobdingnagians wrote: post #348
marcus_holmes wrote: post #127

I find the US prudishness thing so fascinating. I'm travelling at the moment, and meeting lots of Americans (and Europeans for contrast). There's definitely a huge difference in tolerance for swearing and blasphemy. Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject. I guess it all comes down to the religion. Americans do seem to be more religiou…

My church doesn't teach it's only for procreation, and we are solidly Christian. We teach that it's also wholesome, fun, and great to be enjoyed between husbad and wife; a spark of the divine, if you will. That it is between a husband and wife and God to decide when to have children, and so contraception is totally appropriate. Sex helps build the relationship. I remember when my dad taught a lesson at church about h…

OK, so not all churches teach this. But the Catholic church does, and that has been the barometer of western morals for 1500 years. The protestant revolution even went further, with the Puritan movement that influenced the first US immigrants so much.

We can have a discussion about how your church's attitude towards sex pushes people to commit to long-term relationships way too early, but that's a separate discussion.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#443

Post by marcus_holmes »

swiley wrote: post #259
marcus_holmes wrote: post #127

I find the US prudishness thing so fascinating. I'm travelling at the moment, and meeting lots of Americans (and Europeans for contrast). There's definitely a huge difference in tolerance for swearing and blasphemy. Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject. I guess it all comes down to the religion. Americans do seem to be more religiou…

Some uninformed churches may have taught that (there are a lot of pretty wacko churches in the US.) If you actually read the Bible though sex and marriage is supposed to be a sort of alagory for the church’s union with Christ and it’s supposed to be pleasant.

It is the basis of the Catholic Church's opposition to contraception, and has been part of their teachings for over a thousand years now.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#444

Post by marcus_holmes »

dancek wrote: post #175
marcus_holmes wrote: post #127

I find the US prudishness thing so fascinating. I'm travelling at the moment, and meeting lots of Americans (and Europeans for contrast). There's definitely a huge difference in tolerance for swearing and blasphemy. Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject. I guess it all comes down to the religion. Americans do seem to be more religiou…

To be fair, no major Christian church teaches that enjoying sex is a sin. The Roman Catholic Church does teach that contraception is sinful. No major Protestant church does.

I went to an Anglican Sunday school as a kid, and was definitely taught that sex outside marriage was a sin, that sex purely for enjoyment was a sin, and that God invented sex purely and only to make babies.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#445

Post by ropelike_object »

tripzilch wrote: post #438
darkpuma wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just American sensibilities that are in play. When you allow people to upload pornographic material you have to deal with the risk that they'll upload illegal material (shit that's illegal in Europe too, it should be pointed out. And we could dive into a tangent to discuss the topic of ISP-level content blocking in America and the UK if you wish..) If you're unable to effectively filter that stuff out the ne…

> It's not just American sensibilities that are in play. When you allow people to upload pornographic material you have to deal with the risk that they'll upload illegal material (shit that's illegal in Europe too (...)) Umm, disagree. If you allow people to upload beautiful, tasty delicious regular porn, they're not going to automatically upload ugly scary bad disgusting child porn, too. It's not like porn is a "gat…

Consider the premise of pornography's capacity to motivate violence.

This is an often neglected concept. But we see it readily emerging as a cognitive awareness of real denial and promoter of outsider self image, and depersonalization.

So, individuals suddenly notice that they have no access to real sexual gratification, they are only permitted participation as distant observer. They live isolated from the inside of the fishbowl where everyone else has sex, and on the outside of the aquarium glass, desolation.

In frustration, they lash out, violently. Those invited to the party are treated fairly and receive sexual favors as rewards for status, and they are not. Due to ugliness, poverty, or some other outsider status.

This is made plain to those who only consume internet pornography, but shall never realize absurd and unattainable sexual fantasies that internet pornography might provoke.

See:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Isla_Vista_killings

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incel

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#446

Post by marcus_holmes »

bagacrap wrote: post #358
marcus_holmes wrote: post #127

I find the US prudishness thing so fascinating. I'm travelling at the moment, and meeting lots of Americans (and Europeans for contrast). There's definitely a huge difference in tolerance for swearing and blasphemy. Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject. I guess it all comes down to the religion. Americans do seem to be more religiou…

> Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject Yes, it is, unless your subject is bashing Americans.

no, it wasn't. I regret bringing it up now.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#447

Post by marcus_holmes »

azernik wrote: post #169
marcus_holmes wrote: post #127

I find the US prudishness thing so fascinating. I'm travelling at the moment, and meeting lots of Americans (and Europeans for contrast). There's definitely a huge difference in tolerance for swearing and blasphemy. Also several well-educated and seemingly intelligent Americans who hold strong racist opinions. But that's another subject. I guess it all comes down to the religion. Americans do seem to be more religiou…

> Though I can't find that anywhere in any of the commandments, or the new testament. A quibble - while this negative view of sex may not be the view of other texts in the Bible, it is very clearly part of Paul's worldview, as evidenced in e.g. 2 Corinthians.

Ah yes, the old misogynist himself. I forgot about him. Which is stupid of me, because this whole thing probably starts with him.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#448

Post by marcus_holmes »

aussieguy1234 wrote: post #226
marcus_holmes wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had the same idea :) But to make it sustainable, it needs to generate money. Advertisers don't like seeing their brands next to pr0n, so they won't come to your site. Unless, of course, you open it to adverts from people selling sexeh stuff, who can't get an ad to appear anywhere normally. Of course, you could charge for it... but people have been trained to expect internet services for free. Hopefully that's chang…

I have a plan for this. I know of an ad network that will let me run ads on Libr that supports both SFW and NSFW ads. When you sign up for Libr you have to say if your blog is NSFW or not. Then Libr flags all content you post as NSFW or SFW depending on what you choose. I can detect what content is on a page, then run SFW ads around SFW content and relevant NSFW ads around NSFW content. Google used to do the same thi…

good plan, worth a try :) good luck with it

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#449

Post by marcus_holmes »

whack wrote: post #361
m_mueller wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are cultural differences, not genetic ones (for the most part). I think that’s quite a difference as one can adapt over the time span of a couple of generations (or even immediately by strong willed individuals) while race is much more sticky and impossible to shake once you’re born into it. Case in point, when a Roma family settles down, they can in theory just be another Eastern European family to those who d…

FWIW, I don't think cultural discrimination is acceptable either. I've met people who don't bat an eyelid when they hear European accents or southern/Boston/new-York accents, but are openly hostile to those speaking African-American vernacular. Similarly for Mexicans speaking Spanish as well. Also, I've never met a Roma person, but it's my understanding that they can trace their genetic ancestry to Asia, and that the…

the UK is pretty racially diverse. Probably because of the empire (and more recently Europe - lots of Eastern Europeans now). And tends to be less interested in racial differences.

So yes, if a Roma family joined mainstream British culture it would be difficult to tell them apart from any other British family.

Re: Sex censorship killed the internet we love

#450

Post by marcus_holmes »

door5 wrote: post #429
mason55 wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s the difference between cultural discrimination and constructive criticism? Can you complain that the Saudis don’t (didn’t) let women drive or is that cultural discrimination? Anti-FGM campaigns? I’m being intentionally obtuse but there has to be a line somewhere. Or not and people should be free to argue without fear of the label “cultural discrimination”. FWIW I have no idea what the answer is.

It depends whether your criticism is informed and empathetic. Are you criticizing to prove that another group is somehow "lesser" or "other", or are you listening to and supporting activists from within those groups? How informed are you on the issue, etc.

I've bumped into this recently with SE Asian politics. The West has tried to get SE Asia to be democratic for decades. But SE Asians have, almost uniformly, rejected democracy and opted for variations on monarchies, communist autocracies, military juntas, and "elected" dictators.

At what point do we accept that SE Asians don't want to have democratic governments, and just let them do their thing?

OR do we never accept that, of any culture, and keep pushing them to be democratic because it's "better"?

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