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One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

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Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#291

Post by _Codemonkeyism »

dangrossman wrote: post #74
apo wrote: post #62

Few people taking theses tests understand or care about the privacy-destroying effect of what they're doing to themselves and their families. For example, this is from the AncestryDNA (different company) terms of service: By submitting User Provided Content to AncestryDNA, you grant AncestryDNA and the Ancestry Group Companies a perpetual, royalty-free, worldwide, sublicensable, transferable license to host, transfer…

> and their families That's how a local cold murder case was solved last year. DNA from a 25-year-old crime scene was run against the samples in one of these genealogy databases, and they found a familial match. Police set up a sting to covertly collect DNA from that person's immediate family. They got their DNA match with a brother's water bottle police took from a trash can after he worked a DJ gig at a school. htt…

Now you can refuse to support prosecution against family, but your DNA can't.

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#292

Post by ethagnawl »

kaybe wrote: post #162
kilo_bravo_3 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>what they're doing to themselves and their families. This only encourages me. My DNA is on record in various places, and if any relative of mine commits a crime I want the honor of being the person who fucked them and sent them to prison. I would tout the event as an esteemed accomplishment. Everyone seems to be worried about a sci-fi movie where clones are made from cheek swabs or corporations use DNA to deny certa…

As a German, I see many problems with this point of view. What is a crime can change fast, and it can also mean just being of the wrong group. Don't think it can't and won't happen again.

It's a bit of an aside, but I have such respect for you Germans when it comes to owning up to past transgressions. In my experience, when the topic of WWII has come up, it's always been a matter of, "Yes, we fucked up. Now, how do we prevent it from happening again?"

My ancestors came to the USA after the Civil War, so _I_ have no real stake in this, but I married into a family from the midwest/south who has been in the US for many generations and I'm regularly floored when I hear people make claims about how the Civil War was actually about states' rights (to own human beings ...) and such. It seems like these people are still mostly concerned with trying to save face, as opposed to admitting that their forbears _royally_ screwed up and trying to learn and adapt from the episode.

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#293

Post by erikpukinskis »

ptero wrote: post #119
dangrossman wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and their families That's how a local cold murder case was solved last year. DNA from a 25-year-old crime scene was run against the samples in one of these genealogy databases, and they found a familial match. Police set up a sting to covertly collect DNA from that person's immediate family. They got their DNA match with a brother's water bottle police took from a trash can after he worked a DJ gig at a school. htt…

Total surveillance or global DNA law enforcement database would solve many murders and prevent wrongful convictions. However, it would also give many opportunities for framing convenient suspects and "encouraging" confessions. I am sure your case was above board but, being born in a totalitarian state, I do not trust law enforcement too much and prefer to err on the side of not solving some crimes. My 2c.

So, as with all things which can be good or bad depending on use, we allow people to voluntarily choose whether to participate. What’s the problem?

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#294

Post by erikpukinskis »

jhayward wrote: post #112
lotsofpulp wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What rights? Surely if you have rights to your DNA, then your family member has rights to their DNA. It’s just an unfortunate consequence of how DNA works.

It is probably wrong to think of DNA as personal property. Its public use more closely resembles a commons which is shared by many. We don't give individuals the right to pollute air, for instance, simply because they own property that has air on it. Likewise we should develop principles for information which when combined with other information can be used to transgress against 3rd parties' enjoyment of their own pr…

> We don't give individuals the right to pollute air, for instance, simply because they own property that has air on it

Lol, what planet do you live on? Sounds dope.

The battles to price externalities into markets here on Earth are all hard fought. By default if you can’t see it you don’t pay for it. Anything beyond that needs to be pounded out in the political ring.

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#295

Post by erikpukinskis »

noonespecial wrote: post #241
kilo_bravo_3 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>what they're doing to themselves and their families. This only encourages me. My DNA is on record in various places, and if any relative of mine commits a crime I want the honor of being the person who fucked them and sent them to prison. I would tout the event as an esteemed accomplishment. Everyone seems to be worried about a sci-fi movie where clones are made from cheek swabs or corporations use DNA to deny certa…

Right up until that crime happens to be homosexuality (oh you meant western values crimes...) Or you can't get a job because you're closely related to a felon. Or a loan because you are closely related to someone who filed for bankruptcy. I could go on. There's more "ors" here than on a viking raiding ship.

Huh? Homosexuality was illegal in many parts of The West until very recently. I wouldn’t be surprised if it still is some places.

And is it true that homosexuality is banned throughout the east?

What’s the word for when you are ignorant of something your whole life and then you get enlightened and then immediately feel entitled to point out how much better you are than everyone else who is still ignorant? I feel like that’s what you’re doing here.

(To be clear, I have no problem with your point about homosexuality laws. I’m just objecting to your notion of what’s eastern and western. Seems like a lot of people think western=quintessential liberalism, eastern=Saudi Arabia, which is just xenophobic nonsense)

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#296

Post by labster »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #293
ptero wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Total surveillance or global DNA law enforcement database would solve many murders and prevent wrongful convictions. However, it would also give many opportunities for framing convenient suspects and "encouraging" confessions. I am sure your case was above board but, being born in a totalitarian state, I do not trust law enforcement too much and prefer to err on the side of not solving some crimes. My 2c.

So, as with all things which can be good or bad depending on use, we allow people to voluntarily choose whether to participate. What’s the problem?

The problem is the that genetic data discloses PII on other people without their consent. It cannot be a fully voluntary system.

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#297

Post by AmericanChopper »

Jach wrote: post #38
OldSchoolJohnny wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This part is concerning though: "Under the arrangement, the company has also agreed to test DNA evidence for the FBI in its private laboratory." I hope the FBI will corroborate whatever results the private company comes up with later and just use the data to narrow down the suspects.

That's likely how it will play out, DNA evidence is a lot shakier these days since it's better known that DNA can go places the owner has never been. The transition point where juries don't know that though will be a bit scary, no one wants to be falsely implicated (like [0]) because they touched a handle on a bus and later the actual criminal touched it too. [0] https://www.wired.com/story/dna-transfer-framed-murder…

>DNA can go places the owner has never been

Damn right it can. I was on a business trip alone and found some of my wife’s hair in my bed. I know it was hers because there was some more on a jacket in my luggage. I know testing hair isn’t exactly straight forward, but that was her DNA in a country she’s never even been to.

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#298

Post by mrhappyunhappy »

tbyehl wrote: post #97
laken wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with using DNA to identify someone in crime is that we leave DNA everywhere. See this case for example: https://www.wired.com/story/dna-transfer-framed-murder/

Came here to mention that same article. The more important point, to my view, is that the DNA we shed doesn't necessarily stay put. DNA transference, law enforcement access to large DNA databases, familial matching, and advances in extracting DNA from trace samples make for a scary combination. Lukis Anderson was damned lucky that the person who inadvertently transferred his DNA to a crime scene could be identified.

Reading that article and the studies it cites makes me lose all faith in DNA evidence. It seems anyone can be carrying anyone else’s DNA at any given time. What’s the point of considering it as evidence?

Re: One of the Biggest At-Home DNA Testing Companies Is Working with the FBI

#300

Post by Scoundreller »

mirimir wrote: post #288
ptero wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Total surveillance or global DNA law enforcement database would solve many murders and prevent wrongful convictions. However, it would also give many opportunities for framing convenient suspects and "encouraging" confessions. I am sure your case was above board but, being born in a totalitarian state, I do not trust law enforcement too much and prefer to err on the side of not solving some crimes. My 2c.

Same here. However, I have no illusions about stopping any of this. The global panopticon is just too useful for authoritarians. So my solution is to avoid attracting any attention in meatspace. Not doing anything that could generate troublesome records. Such as leaving DNA around. I mean, I certainly leave DNA around, when I go out for stuff. But there's nothing involved that I need to hide. I also make no effort to…

> And I do torrent some, even when I'm not really after anything.

I’d like to subscribe to your RSS feed of magnet: links.

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