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New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

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Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#121

Post by sbuk »

sidibe wrote: post #71
IanCal wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR/etc. absolutely deliver on this: > Frankly it's insulting to say that adults cannot decide for themselves how they want their data used All those laws really push is you have to actually let people know what you're using the data for, ask if you can (so that they're able to decide) and make sure you take care of it. It doesn't say you can't decide for yourself, it just makes it an actual decision.

GDPR does not allow you to trade services in return for using your data for ads. A website can't deny you service if you opt out of tracking, so EU has decided that business model should not be viable even if both parties agree.

That makes no sense. If both parties legitimately agree, then there is nothing that the GDPR can do about it. The issue arises if one party decides that they no longer wish the other party to hold on to their data anymore, and the other party refuses to delete the information and withdraw services. The unacceptable business model for GDPR is providing a service that requires personal data in order to function. Google making search unavailable to those not providing PII would be in breach of the regulation.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#123

Post by aherz »

levesque wrote: post #4

I tried using Google Maps without search history turned on. It's basically a downgraded version. They tied saving locations with the search history, so it won't let you search for friends' contacts, set a home address, etc. Is it on purpose? I don't know, but I find it weird that they would tie some unrelated features together. Why does setting a Home address require search history?

As manipulative as Google can be, we should keep in mind that Google Maps is incredibly useful and we get to use it for "free". Yes we pay with our data and privacy and Google can do a better job of making that transparent but we can only get so upset when we don't get the full version of a product when we don't want to give our data.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#125

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

pnutjam wrote: post #73
levesque wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty useful when you use your phone a lot for navigation / GPS. Saves you a bunch of time, but true it does have the cost of letting Google know where you live (although there are so many other ways for them to get that information that I'm not worried about that part).

I keep all my addresses as "starred" I don't set anything as home or work. I figure it will protect from a cursory db search, but anyone interested can figure out both trivially. What pisses me off is that everytime I turn on my phone gps it defaults to "high accuracy" mode which scans all the wifi ap's around, among other things. I have to manually set it to gps chip only every time.

Your home address is never secret unless you completely disconnect from society. All the data aggregators with an entry on you will get updates soon after every move.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#126

Post by Betelgeuse90 »

dokov wrote: post #106
sidibe wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR does not allow you to trade services in return for using your data for ads. A website can't deny you service if you opt out of tracking, so EU has decided that business model should not be viable even if both parties agree.

That is a sane approach, we need to find a balance and currently there is no balance. For instance, you're not allowed to use your preset home address on google maps by google, if tracking is turned off.

My Location History and Web & App tracking are off, and I'm still able to use my Home and Work addresses on Google Maps. I see many people here have your same experience, which is pretty odd to me. I live in Israel, maybe there's a connection somehow?

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#127

Post by throwawaylolx »

tome wrote: post #88
Roverlord wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've typed the same postcode into Maps almost every day for the past 5 years - Google, could you maybe help it be the first autocomplete result when I enter it manually?

> I've typed the same postcode into Maps almost every day for the past 5 years That's fascinating. Why?

Perhaps checking shared transport schedule/platform to get back home.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#128

Post by NeedMoreTea »

nabla9 wrote: post #89
baxtr wrote: post #3

"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place." Eric Schmidt, 2009

Eric Schmidt has old person concept of privacy. >To the older generation, privacy is about secrecy. And, as the Supreme Court said, once something is no longer secret, it's no longer private. But that's not how privacy works, and it's not how the younger generation thinks about it. Privacy is about control. https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/04/privacy_and_c...

Hadn't seen that before.

I'm about the same age as Bruce, and I often respect what he's written. Not this time. In fact I'd bluntly claim he's wrong.

Let's not conflate privacy and secrecy and blame the old. Secrecy is not revealing the private conversations with a friend of the opposite sex is actually the surface of an affair. It would embarrass (or worse) if revealed. Privacy is not telling because there's no need, that's their business, but happy to tell SO if it came up for some reason.

For the older generation privacy is about control and agency too. Who gets to know mum or dad is ill, what they earn, who can see or use their information or their photo, even who their friends or habits are. The expectation is all of that goes to those who need it or others at the sole discretion of the individual or couple. Volunteered at their discretion unless a job or mortgage depends upon it. They just share a lot less than the kid's generation, but not for reasons of secrecy.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#129

Post by mulmen »

_ptgt wrote: post #119
mulmen wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is IBM included in metaphorical Silicon Valley? What about Expedia? Or Concur? Seems very arbitrary. Is metaphorical Silicon Valley only applicable to negative actions of tech companies or does it apply to all big tech companies? I searched for “metaphorical Silicon Valley” and didn’t see anything relevant. Also how did you get into this beta and where is the actual option? Is it under notifications? I’d prefer to us…

>Is IBM included in metaphorical Silicon Valley? What about Expedia? Or Concur? Seems very arbitrary. Is metaphorical Silicon Valley only applicable to negative actions of tech companies or does it apply to all big tech companies? I searched for “metaphorical Silicon Valley” and didn’t see anything relevant. Right, and while we're at it Goldman Sachs shouldn't be considered part of Wall Street. They're headquartered…

Goldman Sachs is obviously a “Wall Street” company because they are based in NYC and participate in the financial industry.

Amazon, Microsoft, Concur and Expedia are all headquartered in Washington State which is nowhere near Silicon Valley. Similarly IBM is headquartered in New York.

My question is what makes a company outside SV a “SV Company”. This usage of the term is new to me so I am attempting to get a more complete understanding of the meaning.

Re: New study: Google manipulates users into constant tracking

#130

Post by mulmen »

jerf wrote: post #108
mulmen wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is IBM included in metaphorical Silicon Valley? What about Expedia? Or Concur? Seems very arbitrary. Is metaphorical Silicon Valley only applicable to negative actions of tech companies or does it apply to all big tech companies? I searched for “metaphorical Silicon Valley” and didn’t see anything relevant. Also how did you get into this beta and where is the actual option? Is it under notifications? I’d prefer to us…

I didn't do anything in particular to get the beta; the offer got pushed to me. As for SV, the inability to draw a rigid, precise line around a phenomenon doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Life's fuzzy.

So when you say SV Company you mean high-growth technology leveraging company that puts profit first?

I’m honestly struggling to understand how you apply SV to a company that is not physically from SV, or at least very nearby.

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