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Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

workingwa.org

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Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#51

Post by jmull »

standardUser wrote: post #11

This isn't uncommon or new. Many states allow for tips to offset wages, even if wages fall below the minimum wage. Some states even have a separate minimum wage for tipper workers that is below the standard minimum wage. If you want to blame someone, I suggest looking for the actual culprit and not a law-abiding company. This has little to do with Instacart and everything to do with state wage laws.

Just because the law allows it doesn’t mean a company must do it.

It may be legal for instacart to take the tip money but it’s their decision to do so and they deserve the blame.

It’s wrong because the people paying the tip generally believe it goes to the person providing the service, not to the company. And it subverts the purpose, which is to incent and reward good personal service.

So the company ends up screwing their workers, deceiving their customers and disincentizing good service.

Legal, but wrong and stupid.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#52

Post by hsaliak »

nsenifty wrote: post #29
warp_factor wrote: post #17

people should simply NOT tip. At restaurant maybe because it is socially mandatory, but anywhere else, a signal should be sent that it is stupid and doesn't make any economical sense to tip!

It is not "socially" mandatory as much as the workers suffer otherwise because they are paid less than minimum wage.

the market will necessarily sort itself out here. sad but true. if the workers are paid less, they will find employment elsewhere, the company will suffer (as they rightfully should).

Instacart has 1.9b in funding, if they are stealing from their workers, it only means that their business model is broken.. or we as consumers can fall into this dishonest game and normalize it.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#54

Post by lazyasciiart »

excalibur wrote: post #27
awake wrote: post #2

I used to work for a delivery company with this same pay structure. This is garbage and its taking advantage of young people who are looking for jobs.

Is this common? When I tip it's always with the intent of helping the individual, never the company. The much larger original bill is their share, in case they've forgotten. Are cash tips an effective method of keeping grubby corporate hands out of it?

It's an expected business structure in every state where the tipped minimum wage is below actual minimum wage.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#55

Post by gowld »

_t2kx wrote: post #18
tedivm wrote: post #10

There's a related blog post up on Medium by this same group (Working Washington) where they placed the same order, once with tip and once without, so people could directly compare. From my perspective Instacart is stealing from its customers and workers by doing this. I'm a huge fan of instacart (my fiance and I use it regularly), but this is definitely going to push me away from the platform. At a minimum I'm going…

> From my perspective Instacart is stealing from its customers and workers by doing this. This is 100% wage theft.

According to what ruling?

It depends on the agreement between Instacart and delivery staff.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#56

Post by jetrink »

B-Con wrote: post #32

> That's right: the customer's tip doesn't get added to the worker's check — it just gets deducted from what Instacart pays. In other words, up-front tips go to Instacart, not to the worker. My understanding is that the Fair Labor Standards Act does not allow for employers to whithold tips.[0] Gratuity/tip is a legally recognized concept. You can't just throw the word in your app and do what you want with the money i…

> My understanding is that the Fair Labor Standards Act does allow for employers to whithold tips

I think this sentence says the opposite of what you intended it to.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#57

Post by Finnucane »

chatmasta wrote: post #33
standardUser wrote: post #11

This isn't uncommon or new. Many states allow for tips to offset wages, even if wages fall below the minimum wage. Some states even have a separate minimum wage for tipper workers that is below the standard minimum wage. If you want to blame someone, I suggest looking for the actual culprit and not a law-abiding company. This has little to do with Instacart and everything to do with state wage laws.

Yes, this is common in the restaurant industry. But a few differences: (1) Tips are expected in the restaurant industry (2) Waitstaff knows what they're signing up for (3) The restaurant does not adjust wages after tips have been received

For many years, we've been in the habit of leaving restaurant tips in cash, because of various reports that restaurant managers would basically take card fees out of the tip. I recall hearing more recently that there has been some effort to crack down on that practice, but still, old habits.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#58

Post by prolepunk »

nsenifty wrote: post #22

This is why the tipping system in the US is absurd. The whole "you must tip because they get paid peanuts" argument is a circular logic. How about making sure that the worker gets paid fairly by their employer and customers can then optionally tip for outstanding service?

It is absurd because its started as a racist system to exclude black people from service industry.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#59

Post by lazyasciiart »

hsaliak wrote: post #52
nsenifty wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not "socially" mandatory as much as the workers suffer otherwise because they are paid less than minimum wage.

the market will necessarily sort itself out here. sad but true. if the workers are paid less, they will find employment elsewhere, the company will suffer (as they rightfully should). Instacart has 1.9b in funding, if they are stealing from their workers, it only means that their business model is broken.. or we as consumers can fall into this dishonest game and normalize it.

> if the workers are paid less, they will find employment elsewhere

Thats a big assumption that is demonstrably untrue in many specific cases.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#60

Post by gowld »

How about paying people who serve you instead of passing the "buck" to the someone else?

Why start tipping for outstanding service, instead of setting the floor at $0 for 0 service?

Answer: because people like to pay less for stuff and let the company eat the blame.

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