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H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

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Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#51

Post by sn_master »

h1bslave wrote: post #15

I’ve been on h1b for over 7 years now , with no chance of getting a green card because I was born in India , all my immigrant friends who started working at the same time have already gotten their green cards - they all have the option to quit their jobs if they feel like they are being underpaid or exploited. But not me , I’m looking at 70 years before I get my freedom , until then I have to tolerate the indentured…

What are you talking about ? Most Indians I know on H1B did one and sometimes more job transfers it never came as a problem. Don't believe me, go check LinkedIn. I can point you to atleast a dozen profiles of folks I know personally who did that.

H1B is perfectly transferable and I don't know anyone who was worried about moving to/within FAANG because of H1B.

Enough hyperbole please. Yes, its frustrating to not get greencard, but H1B is very far from slavery.

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#52

Post by wundering »

h1bslave wrote: post #35
geodel wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So basically 2 things: 1) Things will be worse than indentured servitude if you go back. 2) Dollars are more valuable Rupees even it is earned by slavery.

Yeah , that is spot on.

Did you get the sarcasm in your parent post? If you really believe that your indentured servitude in the "land of the free" is better than living a free life back home, you have no reason to complain.

From what I know, going back to India is not bad at all. A lot of Indians return to bigger and better prospects back home.

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#53

Post by temp4358 »

diogenescynic wrote: post #40
baby wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most Americans would probably be happier with fewer H-1Bs America's education system is pretty poor. It would be nothing without H1Bs. Take it from Michio Kaku[1]: "The United States has the worst education system known to science. Our graduates compete regularly at the level of third world countries. How come the scientific establishment of the US doesn't collapse. If we are producing a generation of dummy. If the…

If there’s a quota to specialized knowledge workers, give them to the highest paid thus the most needed. Shouldn’t be given out in some stupid lottery... I want them to bring in people making the highest wages so they contribute the most to the economy. Not these $70k H-1Bs with fake work locations. Not going to bother defending our education system since so many foreigners are trying to get into our colleges, I’d sa…

Except the top colleges like MIT, stanford, etc, most foreigners get into US colleges because it is an easier path to get a work visa in US, that's it. Also, the 70k h1-B are currently working in US, so they pay US taxes. If they are not allowed, most of the work will be outsourced (and a lot of that has already been), so it will be a further loss to US.

Also, India uses human resource as a balance in trade. They allow US companies to sell stuff in India in luie of them highering indians abroad (which send a part of the salary back home to their family) or in India. If US applies an America first policy in everything then India has no incentive to allow these companies into India. Software companies are not creating super critical things which can't be replicated, specially by indians who are already working for Google, Facebook, etc who will lose their jobs.

EDIT : Currently there are no tariffs on Tech companies. What are people even arguing ?

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#54

Post by diogenescynic »

baby wrote: post #44
diogenescynic wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there’s a quota to specialized knowledge workers, give them to the highest paid thus the most needed. Shouldn’t be given out in some stupid lottery... I want them to bring in people making the highest wages so they contribute the most to the economy. Not these $70k H-1Bs with fake work locations. Not going to bother defending our education system since so many foreigners are trying to get into our colleges, I’d sa…

Then you're losing on diversity.

No. We have an entire other immigration category for that...

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#55

Post by throwaway8611 »

diogenescynic wrote: post #37
h1bslave wrote: post #15

I’ve been on h1b for over 7 years now , with no chance of getting a green card because I was born in India , all my immigrant friends who started working at the same time have already gotten their green cards - they all have the option to quit their jobs if they feel like they are being underpaid or exploited. But not me , I’m looking at 70 years before I get my freedom , until then I have to tolerate the indentured…

No offense to you personally, but most Americans would probably be happier with fewer H-1Bs. They are only brought over to depress wages and underpay workers. So while I sympathize with your condition, I’d like an actual ban on these types of fake specialized knowledge visa categories. L-1 and H-1 are so grossly abused it’s not even funny. The entire prevailing wage is famed and they bring over people from India with…

There are many kinds of people on H1Bs. There are people that are brought here by the consultancies you mention and there are graduates from American Universities who get H1Bs after or during their OPT. While I've heard that H1Bs are brought over to depress wages, although there is no data to back that up. In both these cases, there are a mixture of really good people, really bad people who got lucky and everything in between. I also know that there are rampant scams that involve faking Resumes to fake universities, however, there are many many many good people still holding out in the hope that this backlog for Indian's and some other countries resolves and lets them lead a better life.

However, according to this article[1], the number of open positions in Programming and Comp Sci. was about 500k and the US produced about 50-60k grads a year, 85k H1Bs wouldn't be enough to take all the jobs and flood the job market.

Also, from my own experience, I make over $250k as a Software Engineer, stuck on an H1B forever, while people who were born in other countries get to move on to a Green Card, even if they earn less than that. My company interviews hundreds of people, settling for 'good enough' and yet struggles to fill many open positions.

[1] https://qz.com/929275/you-probably-should-have-majored-in-co...

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#56

Post by sn_master »

h1bslave wrote: post #27
jorge-d wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why would you spend so many years in a country where you feel enslaved?

Because hope , because I believe in America.

+1 to the Europe comment. You can become a citizen in Ireland by working 5 years. Same for a couple more European countries atleast.

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#57

Post by ph0kz »

diogenescynic wrote: post #49
ph0kz wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I voted for Obama. I believe in immigration So, you are ok with blue collar American workers getting affected by the programs like DACA, TPS, illegal immigration etc., but when it comes to your white collar job, you don't like uncontrolled "driving down wages"?

DACA is for people who were brought over as kids. Not really their fault. What are we supposed to do send them to a country they never even grew up in? TPS? Like Vietnam war era refugees? I mean, you’re clearly trying to conflate some big differences in immigration... No, I’m for immigration that’s actually needed—like doctors and specialized researchers. But having worked for an immigration firm an seen what a lot o…

Irrespective of the reason for non-citizens to be here, It could drive down wages. You, an Obama voter is echoing the sentiments of Trump supporters that the immigrants, illegal or otherwise is hurting American citizens.

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#58

Post by User23 »

wundering wrote: post #52
h1bslave wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah , that is spot on.

Did you get the sarcasm in your parent post? If you really believe that your indentured servitude in the "land of the free" is better than living a free life back home, you have no reason to complain. From what I know, going back to India is not bad at all. A lot of Indians return to bigger and better prospects back home.

It's self-evident that the world as a whole would be better served if people who go to the United States, the EU, Japan, or anywhere else with top notch institutions and learn valuable skills were to go take those skills and apply them in places where they aren't generally available. As a bonus it will be extremely lucrative for those persons, since they will have highly marketable skills that aren't widely available in their locale.

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#59

Post by jorblumesea »

throwaway-oid wrote: post #46
h1bslave wrote: post #15

I’ve been on h1b for over 7 years now , with no chance of getting a green card because I was born in India , all my immigrant friends who started working at the same time have already gotten their green cards - they all have the option to quit their jobs if they feel like they are being underpaid or exploited. But not me , I’m looking at 70 years before I get my freedom , until then I have to tolerate the indentured…

Is staying in the US really that much better than trying to make it big in India? Ironically, many of my Chinese colleagues have returned to China because they can make a lot more money there. And they will have a higher chance of being promoted to executive positions. In addition, among my Chinese American friends, just about all of them say that their relatives that stayed in China are wealthier and more successful…

I find this hard to believe, are Chinese software engineer salaries FAANG level? It's not unheard of for senior engineering salaries to push 250k easily for a large company.

Also, isn't the work life balance horrible for Chinese workers?

Re: H-1B: Oracle favored hiring foreign graduates of US colleges over American grads

#60

Post by diogenescynic »

throwaway8611 wrote: post #55
diogenescynic wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense to you personally, but most Americans would probably be happier with fewer H-1Bs. They are only brought over to depress wages and underpay workers. So while I sympathize with your condition, I’d like an actual ban on these types of fake specialized knowledge visa categories. L-1 and H-1 are so grossly abused it’s not even funny. The entire prevailing wage is famed and they bring over people from India with…

There are many kinds of people on H1Bs. There are people that are brought here by the consultancies you mention and there are graduates from American Universities who get H1Bs after or during their OPT. While I've heard that H1Bs are brought over to depress wages, although there is no data to back that up. In both these cases, there are a mixture of really good people, really bad people who got lucky and everything i…

Either you’re lying or misinformed. The data is obviously available, the government has to approve the applications... there are literally dozens of websites that track this “h-1b salary info” and yes they are usually underpaid compared to their peers of comparable skills. I have linked plenty of studies in prior comments. See my above comment showing most are underpaid.

Then train local candidates or do apprenticeships. It’s a lie that local workers can’t do the work. Most h-1b is not the complex work... it’s the QA and grunt work.

The skills gap is a myth: http://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/education/the-stem-crisis-i...

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