Live data from Hacker News

The pros and cons of placebo buttons

economist.com

31–40 of 142 posts

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#31

I work in New York, but I go to Seattle periodically because that's where my company's headquarters is. How people treat the buttons is wildly different between those two cities. I hardly ever see anyone press the cross button in NY, since the convention is to wait for there to be no cars and then cross (and not bother with the button). In Seattle, I've seen people wait patiently at a cross walk even though there's n…

The $70 dollar fine in Seattle will make anyone very patient.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#32

I work in New York, but I go to Seattle periodically because that's where my company's headquarters is. How people treat the buttons is wildly different between those two cities. I hardly ever see anyone press the cross button in NY, since the convention is to wait for there to be no cars and then cross (and not bother with the button). In Seattle, I've seen people wait patiently at a cross walk even though there's n…

In Boston, we cross in front of cars that have a green light :). Although honestly, the cars aren't moving because there's too much traffic to go anywhere as box-blocking laws aren't enforced as it is in NYC.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#33
post #24
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe jaywalking is illegal, and enforced in Seattle. When I'm in the UK I will normally not press the pedestrian button (unless its the type of pedestrian only crossing which only activate with the button, not on traffic lights on a junction) . But when I'm in the US, or a different country with jaywalking laws, I will stick to the rules much more rigidly. I also really enjoy the first time crossing a road when…

Jaywalking is illegal pretty much everywhere in the US, but enforcement is very selective and regional.

Jaywalking is a $1 ticket in Massachusetts. I believe it's there simply to assign fault in a crash.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#34
post #20

I work in New York, but I go to Seattle periodically because that's where my company's headquarters is. How people treat the buttons is wildly different between those two cities. I hardly ever see anyone press the cross button in NY, since the convention is to wait for there to be no cars and then cross (and not bother with the button). In Seattle, I've seen people wait patiently at a cross walk even though there's n…

I believe jaywalking is illegal, and enforced in Seattle. When I'm in the UK I will normally not press the pedestrian button (unless its the type of pedestrian only crossing which only activate with the button, not on traffic lights on a junction) . But when I'm in the US, or a different country with jaywalking laws, I will stick to the rules much more rigidly. I also really enjoy the first time crossing a road when…

I always thought jaywalking was crossing outside of a marked crosswalk? I didn't know it had anything to do with the colour of the traffic light, that said, I also live in New York and we got our own rules anyhow.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#35

I notice a lot in London that there are a bunch of pedestrian lights in areas witha steady flow of traffic that will only work if the button has been pressed, yet every single day I see people, often the same people, stand there until someone else presses the button. Part of me wonders if there's almost an aspect of not wanting to cause offense involved. If you're the person who presses the button, you're responsible…

If traffic is heavy and I think I won't get a chance to cross then I push the button. Otherwise I just wait and cross when there's a gap without bothering anyone.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#36

I notice a lot in London that there are a bunch of pedestrian lights in areas witha steady flow of traffic that will only work if the button has been pressed, yet every single day I see people, often the same people, stand there until someone else presses the button. Part of me wonders if there's almost an aspect of not wanting to cause offense involved. If you're the person who presses the button, you're responsible…

I’ve seen this behavior in parts of Europe where offending other people in traffic is much less frowned-upon than in England. I think it’s just the case of everyone assuming that someone else has pressed the button.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#37
post #34
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe jaywalking is illegal, and enforced in Seattle. When I'm in the UK I will normally not press the pedestrian button (unless its the type of pedestrian only crossing which only activate with the button, not on traffic lights on a junction) . But when I'm in the US, or a different country with jaywalking laws, I will stick to the rules much more rigidly. I also really enjoy the first time crossing a road when…

I always thought jaywalking was crossing outside of a marked crosswalk? I didn't know it had anything to do with the colour of the traffic light, that said, I also live in New York and we got our own rules anyhow.

As far as I'm aware, jaywalking is crossing outside a crosswalk (in my area I believe all intersections are considered to have crosswalks), OR against a light. If the hand says no go and you go, you're jaywalking.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#38

I notice a lot in London that there are a bunch of pedestrian lights in areas witha steady flow of traffic that will only work if the button has been pressed, yet every single day I see people, often the same people, stand there until someone else presses the button. Part of me wonders if there's almost an aspect of not wanting to cause offense involved. If you're the person who presses the button, you're responsible…

I avoid pressing the button if there is a chance of crossing without having to delay traffic.

The only reason being that, when driving, I wish people would do the same since I always seem to get held up by a red light when the person who pressed the button has long since gone.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#39
post #3

I feel like there is a bit of ethical hysteresis here. If you have buttons that are designed to be placebo from the start, I find that unethical. If you have buttons that work, but have to be disabled due to a change in plans, that strikes me as less problematic (but they should still eventually be removed). So, how you get there matters.

Eh. I think although it's a 'dark pattern', it's one with measured effects on behaviour that result in less people crossing against the light, which (I would assume) correlates with less accidents. I think calling it unethical is a bit much.

Call it impractical then? At least in Lebanon, as people become aware of this deception, they came to reject crosswalk rules in general. Ethics notwithstanding, breaking the honesty clause of the social contract is going to backfire on you.

Re: The pros and cons of placebo buttons

#40
post #32

I work in New York, but I go to Seattle periodically because that's where my company's headquarters is. How people treat the buttons is wildly different between those two cities. I hardly ever see anyone press the cross button in NY, since the convention is to wait for there to be no cars and then cross (and not bother with the button). In Seattle, I've seen people wait patiently at a cross walk even though there's n…

In Boston, we cross in front of cars that have a green light :). Although honestly, the cars aren't moving because there's too much traffic to go anywhere as box-blocking laws aren't enforced as it is in NYC.

$1 fine for you! (....and me) https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2014/07/23/fear-getti...
Post reply on HN