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Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

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Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#51

Post by evjim »

lolsal wrote: post #30
jwagenet wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is some spillover from Washington or California, but I doubt that it can be an incredibly high percentage. Frankly, I think it’s better that these cans and bottles are being recycled, fraudulently or otherwise. I’m sure it hurts the Oregon pocketbook, but according to the article, the cost of the program is only six figures. This is only a problem (cost wise) when redemption is over 1…

> I wouldn’t be surprised if there is some spillover from Washington or California, but I doubt that it can be an incredibly high percentage. Why do you doubt that it could be a high percentage? A huge number of folks live in Vancouver across the OR/WA border and commute into Portland every day, and do their shopping in OR for the lack of sales tax.

You just said it. They do their shopping in Oregon. So they probably buy the bottles their tax free. Save ten cents on tax, spend it on deposit. It's a wash to the consumer.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#52

Post by ceejayoz »

claudiulodro wrote: post #27
nkurz wrote: post #9

There is fear that some significant portion of the recent increase in redemption rate may be due to fraud. Oregon recently increased the redemption from 5 cents to 10 cents, but the neighboring state of Washington still does not have a deposit. This creates an incentive for people to scavenge bottles in Washington and return them across the border in Oregon. Here's a recent article about the problem: "Oregon senator…

The large grocery stores in Oregon are required to accept up to 144 bottles per person per day (or $14.40/person/store/day in potential profit). At that price it doesn't really seem to be worth it to do that sort of arbitrage.

You wouldn't defraud the system by taking redeeming at someone else's store. You'd open your own version of something like https://www.bottledropcenters.com/.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#53

Post by theoh »

sokoloff wrote: post #21
jwagenet wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is some spillover from Washington or California, but I doubt that it can be an incredibly high percentage. Frankly, I think it’s better that these cans and bottles are being recycled, fraudulently or otherwise. I’m sure it hurts the Oregon pocketbook, but according to the article, the cost of the program is only six figures. This is only a problem (cost wise) when redemption is over 1…

There's no doubt some significant overhead to the program, that is likely modeled as being covered in part by the "slippage" of bottles that don't get returned. Fraudulent returns cut into that allowance, even before the redemption rate hits 100%.

How does the Oregon program "know" if a returned bottle is bona fide or fraudulent (from out of state)? I don't see how substituting units of a fungible quantity, which identical bottles seem to be, can have the consequences you suggest.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#54

Post by Symbiote »

mediaman wrote: post #22
Shivetya wrote: post #6

So my question is, how much of the material they are taking is getting to recyclers? None of the articles linked within the original give a number. They do highlight that curbside pickup of recyclables is pretty much a dead end but that has been suspected for a long time. when the public is rewarded for returning a usable product, usable in the sense it is worth more to recyclers, they apparently do it quite often. t…

I'm not sure on what portion goes to recyclers, but I have been to the plant that processes all these return bottles, and I suspect that a fairly high percent is going through that facility. It's a 24/7 operation with sophisticated grinding, washing, and sorting equipment, producing clean flake for use by bottle manufacturers. The owners say demand has been very strong for the finished product.

In Denmark, the system says the collected bottles and cans are of good enough quality to be re-made into food containers:

> The advantage of this system is that the material can continue to have adequate quality to be used again for food. Strict health regulations cover the aluminium, plastic and glass we drink from.

> This is why aluminium from used beer cans may solely be used for new beer cans if it has not been mixed with other aluminium items such as empty paint cans. Similarly, glass bottles cannot be recycled into new bottles containing soft drinks if the glass has been mixed with waste glass from light bulbs, for example.

> When we send plastic, glass and aluminium from bottles and cans for processing, the material goes exclusively to facilities and companies that are approved to manufacture food packaging. We inspect regularly to ensure that the requirements are met.

https://www.danskretursystem.dk/en/use-again-and-again/close...

The statistics for recycling etc are here, but my Danish isn't good enough to skim through and find the relevant figures: https://www.danskretursystem.dk/presse/#/documents/aarsrappo...

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#55

Post by dawnerd »

sigfubar wrote: post #7

> A row of sparkling clean reverse vending machines greet customers Yeah, these won't stay "sparkling clean" for long. I used to make an effort to redeem bottle deposits: I'd pull up in my truck and attempt to unload everything I've accumulated over the preceding couple of weeks. Eventually I got tired of jostling into position in front of the machine, arguing with the homeless, and getting into fights over who gets…

That’s assuming they even work. Best bet is to go to a Costco, they at least keep it mostly clean and functional. Although you then have to stand in the returns line to get your money or argue with a cashier that they have to redeem the slip.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#56

Post by thoughtpalette »

SlowRobotAhead wrote: post #32
pmiller2 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People return bottles and cans in Michigan, though, because of the 10 cent deposit and the fact you can return them directly to any store that sells the product. Not having to go to a recycling center is huge. They are generally picked up and, presumably, recycled, by the bottler.

In case people aren't from Michigan and don't understand how this works... Many stores have automated scanning machines. You feel UNCRUSHED bottles and cans in, a worm drive spins them around while scanning for the barcode. If that can was sold in MI, you get a .10 credit. You just stand there feeding them in at bigger stores. Many of the grocery stores devoted a portion of their cart storage / entry to these machine…

Moved away from MI, but I was not a fan of getting gross old soda on my hands when feeding them into the machines. The .10c is something I'm missing though.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#57

Post by lqet »

nkurz wrote: post #9

There is fear that some significant portion of the recent increase in redemption rate may be due to fraud. Oregon recently increased the redemption from 5 cents to 10 cents, but the neighboring state of Washington still does not have a deposit. This creates an incentive for people to scavenge bottles in Washington and return them across the border in Oregon. Here's a recent article about the problem: "Oregon senator…

You overload your inventory and you blow your margins on gasoline. It doesn't work!

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#58

Post by benj111 »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #48
benj111 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a problem? 100% of deposits have been paid for by people. If someone else returns their bottle and the deposit payer can't be bothered, that's a win win surely.

No. They're not paid if the buyer is in a state that doesn't have a bottle deposit.

No...? What?

I get that Washington bottle buyer hasn't paid a deposit. But if Oregon bottle buyer has paid a deposit for a bottle, but chooses not to recycle it, there is a deposit that has been paid, but not claimed. What is the problem with the Washington bottle buyer returning their bottle in return for the deposit back? A bottle is returned, which is surely the aim of the deposit. The return rate is below 100% so there aren't unfunded deposits.

Re: Oregon Bottle Deposit System Hits 90 Percent Redemption Rate

#60

Post by dwighttk »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #48
benj111 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a problem? 100% of deposits have been paid for by people. If someone else returns their bottle and the deposit payer can't be bothered, that's a win win surely.

No. They're not paid if the buyer is in a state that doesn't have a bottle deposit.

as long as the redemption rate is below 100%, then it doesn't really matter. The deposit isn't a dime taped to the inside of the can/bottle...
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