Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 124 posts

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#111

Post by noobiemcfoob »

Faaak wrote: post #98
noobiemcfoob wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most leases will explicitly require the landlord have unfettered access to the property. Usually, the only caveat being that the tenant will be given some amount of notice. My leases say 24 hours. /If I ever came to one of my properties and my key didn't work, you better bet you'd be evicted.

I see two options: 1) You announce before 24h, and therefore the renter can lend you a set of keys 2) You come unannounced. If it's an emergency you can break the door. If it's not then you've got no business being there.

On 2) NO! I'm not busting down my own door to get into my property. And if I have to, I'm evicting you.

On your greater point, there are a million ways to skin a Roman senator. There are alternatives that don't require a smartlock and if an otherwise great tenant (or applicant) really pressed the issue, perhaps I'd go with another one. In the absence of that, I'll go with what's easiest and sensibly secure (which, by the by, a smartlock is).

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#112

Post by perl4ever »

DKnoll wrote: post #100
Faaak wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Switzerland at least: no. It's considered the same as painting the walls: they have to be identical when you move out. In the meantime you do what you want. But frankly, I would do it even if it was forbidden, as long as the door wouldn't be reinforced.

Happy to hear that. Where I live (Ontario, Canada) it's not explicitly illegal but landlords are allowed to make the tenant not changing the locks a condition of their lease and most do because it is enforceable.

In the US where I live, I think I have noticed in more than one lease agreement something that says you may change the locks at your own expense if you want. I'm not sure how standard it is, but I've never seen anything that says you can't change them.

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#113

Post by DKnoll »

perl4ever wrote: post #112
DKnoll wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Happy to hear that. Where I live (Ontario, Canada) it's not explicitly illegal but landlords are allowed to make the tenant not changing the locks a condition of their lease and most do because it is enforceable.

In the US where I live, I think I have noticed in more than one lease agreement something that says you may change the locks at your own expense if you want. I'm not sure how standard it is, but I've never seen anything that says you can't change them.

It's odd that they make concessions like that in a lease agreement but that's great. Ontario generally favours tenants in legal matters but the locks thing bothers me a bit. I currently have an issue with my landlord and I know they have made illegal entry to my unit and others in my building (illegal meaning without 24hr notice for a valid reason or not because of an emergency) and I can't change my locks. My only option at the moment (because I have no proof to take to the Landlord and Tenant Board) is to place a camera in my apartment which I don't particularly like doing.

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#114

Post by guenthert »

apexalpha wrote: post #81
mrweasel wrote: post #53

There's no a single IoT device available that I would want to install in my home, let alone a lock. I can understand the need for IoT device in industry, such as remote monitoring of device in the field. For home use I have yet to see a device that make any sense. IoT is at this point complete marketing hype, and very little practical application.

>For home use I have yet to see a device that make any sense. Slightly off-topic but I have a thermostat that only turns on when my phone (or me) is on the way home and it automatically turns it off when I leave my home. It saves me _considerable_ amount on my heating bill, especially since I'm not home on a regular schedule and often don't know until hours in advance.

Hmmh, I on the other hand, turn on the heating when I come home, then exercise. Once I'm done, I feel warm and soon it actually is. But that's just me.

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#115

Post by tpaschalis »

noobiemcfoob wrote: post #102
Faaak wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can also give the technician the property's renter's phone number and let themselves coordinate.

You are greatly overestimating the amount of energy and time the average tenant will put into fixing anything in the property. I wish I could count on them to help in coordinating.

Well, anecdote, but in most cases I know (South Europe) it's the tenants chasing behind the landlord to fix issues in their homes, and not vice versa :P Why wouldn't one want stuff on the property he's renting (and paying dearly for it) fixed?

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#116

Post by learnstats2 »

gambiting wrote: post #28
learnstats2 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not a benefit of landlord's legal right to access. Even if you consider these particular benefits, you should be able to make the choice of whether or not to give your landlord (or another trusted person) a spare key.

>>you should be able to make the choice of whether or not to give your landlord (or another trusted person) a spare key. I do have that choice. I can go and change my locks today if I chose to and the landlord can't legally stop me from doing so. I just chose not to, because to me(personally) the landlord having the key is worth the benefit it provides.

You can choose to do that, but it's ambiguous whether or not it's legal e.g. https://www.landlordlawblog.co.uk/2011/03/07/tenants-legal-h...

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#117

Post by around_here »

telesilla wrote: post #89
apexalpha wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>For home use I have yet to see a device that make any sense. Slightly off-topic but I have a thermostat that only turns on when my phone (or me) is on the way home and it automatically turns it off when I leave my home. It saves me _considerable_ amount on my heating bill, especially since I'm not home on a regular schedule and often don't know until hours in advance.

I'm also a proponent of smart thermostats. It's a godsend to be able to have the heating turned up automatically before waking, and as I'm getting home. I have no regrets whatsoever although of course, I'm concerned about my presence data being available to the company running the tech. But I would never put in a smart lock - I see no benefit whatsoever.

They had programmable thermostats that didn't tell everyone who had access what you're up to. They fit the use cases of almost everyone.

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#118

Post by telesilla »

around_here wrote: post #117
telesilla wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also a proponent of smart thermostats. It's a godsend to be able to have the heating turned up automatically before waking, and as I'm getting home. I have no regrets whatsoever although of course, I'm concerned about my presence data being available to the company running the tech. But I would never put in a smart lock - I see no benefit whatsoever.

They had programmable thermostats that didn't tell everyone who had access what you're up to. They fit the use cases of almost everyone.

I am intrigued now to see if I can figure out whether it's sending my data outside of the system.

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#119

Post by noobiemcfoob »

tpaschalis wrote: post #115
noobiemcfoob wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are greatly overestimating the amount of energy and time the average tenant will put into fixing anything in the property. I wish I could count on them to help in coordinating.

Well, anecdote, but in most cases I know (South Europe) it's the tenants chasing behind the landlord to fix issues in their homes, and not vice versa :P Why wouldn't one want stuff on the property he's renting (and paying dearly for it) fixed?

You would think a tenant would be eager to get something fixed. I had a tenant with a broken water heater who waited 3 weeks to tell me. In the winter! /shrug I try not to judge

Re: Landlords forcing smart locks on tenants

#120

Post by lil_cain »

brmgb wrote: post #94
cmg wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you need to provide your landlord with a copy of the key to your new lock? In the US, it's standard for a rental agreement and/or state law to specify that the landlord can enter your property with 24 hours notice even if you're not there, or to enter immediately in case of an emergency.

> In the US, it's standard for a rental agreement and/or state law to specify that the landlord can enter your property with 24 hours notice even if you're not there, or to enter immediately in case of an emergency. As a European, I find the idea extremely shocking. Here entering the residence of someone without their explicit consent is considered home invasion and can net you a year in jail and a fine of up to 1500…

Worth noting: this kind of rule is both normal, & legal in both IE & UK. The idea that this wasn't the case somewhere sounds weird (although nice!) to my European ears.
Post reply on HN