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Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

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Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#111

Post by ryanbrunner »

lewisjoe wrote: post #98
acemarke wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. To repeat Dan Abramov's standard reply: > The set of dependencies that Create-React-App uses includes: > A compiler. a bundler/linker, an optimizing minifier, a linter, a development server with live reloading, and a test runner All of those are isolated and scoped to that one project, and they are all build-time dependencies only. It's also important to understand that Javascript packages are effectively distri…

Here's an interesting observation from recent HN reactions to JS: + The hardcore server folks are hating JS these days, because it requires more than dropping a single script tag. + The full-stack people / JS beginners are hating JS with a passion , because they think it's unneeded complexity for their deadline. + Advanced JS veterans totally like how the JS ecosystem is rapidly maturing & solving its problems in int…

I think this is all true, but one important factor is that there's currently an assumption that any serious project must necessarily use all this complexity, which makes your second point true - but not in a way that's the fault of javascript, but more the community around it.

If you're making a simple site, or even a fairly simple application, the typical modern Javascript toolchain is absolutely unneeded complexity. It's not even React - many developers will turn their nose up on anything that isn't using Redux / Typescript / GraphQL / whatever flavour of the week is popular, even on sites where Javascript itself is probably not that big a requirement. As an example, we're all talking on a site that has almost no Javascript and works perfectly well - but I have no doubt that if you hired a developer to build a site like this in 2018 it would absolutely use a typical complex setup.

That isn't Javascript's fault, really - no library demands that you use it for everything, and many like Redux make it a point to push users away from using them inappropriately. But the Javascript community is currently in a phase that's probably unhealthily pushed towards the new, shiny, more complex library, regardless of how well it suits the problem.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#112

Post by ryanbrunner »

mncharity wrote: post #83
juddlyon wrote: post #4

This is a solid list, but front end dev has gotten a bit absurd. I feel like I need to install 86,000 dependencies via NPM to do something that server-side frameworks already figured out. I was following a simple Vue/Vuex tutorial the other day and my node_modules directory was 200MB+. Use yarn or npm to install XYZ.... What's the difference? Why do I have to google this as step 0? Why do you assume I know the intric…

2010: The food is poor, the seats are uncomfortable, the wifi is slow, and we're running half and hour late. 1910: We dream of human flight. 2018: So many dependencies; so much disk; who can understand why it all exists; how can anyone stay current; how can you trust it all. 1981: We dream of reusable software, of assemblable software components, of sharing.

I don't totally buy this comparison. People aren't bemoaning that shared libraries exist in the first place, they're arguing that Javascript's particular approach to them isn't great.

Javascript didn't invent shared modules, but their particular approach has led to an explosion of libraries with marginal utility, an anemic at best standard library, dependency management that has historically been a big source of problems and still isn't as mature as other languages approaches, disk size explosion due to each individual application storing their own dependencies (and dependencies often storing different version of libraries in their dependencies).

You don't see nearly as many arguments with say, Bundler and the gem ecosystem in ruby.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#113

Post by Dowwie »

soneca wrote: post #14
Dowwie wrote: post #13

This article makes it sound like the grid layouts of the CSS Frameworks have a legitimate reason for updating. Is this a matter of swapping out grids?

Used by them. It is a new property added to CSS language Edit: well, parent was a question that is now edited

sorry about that..

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#114

Post by GordonS »

JamesBarney wrote: post #95
ng12 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's a language/domain/framework that's _not_ like this? After spending a few weeks struggling with Bazel and Spring you'll not convince me Java is any better.

.NET has some warts but it's pretty plug and play. Exception are xamarin, which I give them a pass for because most cross platform technologies are a little rough getting started, and office 365 add-ons. I don't have any direct experience but I also assuming sharepoint is awful.

I use ASP.NET Core MVC, and it's wonderful. ASP.NET has really matured well, and it's honestly a joy to use.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#115

Post by GordonS »

randomsearch wrote: post #108

I’m fairly new to web dev and using Vue. Web dev is a complete mess, it’s true. I also think the direction of travel is good from what I’ve seen, we’re making progress in improving it. For example, introducing types, getting away from hacks like bootstrap etc. What I do find infuriating is that it seems most of the problems are not new and already well solved. Ultimately it looks like web dev is going to be quite sim…

> hacks like bootstrap

Do you mean Twitter Bootstrap, the CSS framework? I've never considered it a 'hack'?

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#116

Post by GordonS »

randomsearch wrote: post #103
Etheryte wrote: post #42

> CSS grid > If you’re still using heavy-weight grid frameworks from UI toolkits like Bootstrap or Foundation, you are falling behind. This is a pretty sensationalist way to word this and honestly an absurd statement as a whole. If you have a public-facing site, ignoring everything that isn't up-to-date is a luxury you can't afford and blunt statements like these show ignorance in that regard.

If I switch to Grid for layout, don’t I still need Bootstrap for other things, eg toolbars, buttons....? Or is there a more lightweight choice for those?

Unless you want to create your own styles for components like buttons from scratch, yes, you will still need a CSS framework. There are a plethora of such frameworks available today, many of which are lighter than Bootstrap (and don't require JQuery).

I'm very familiar with Bootstrap though, so I'll personally continue to use it for a long time to come, unless there is a really compelling reason to use another framework.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#117

Post by yakshaving_jgt »

randomsearch wrote: post #105
leowoo91 wrote: post #102

Fullstack dev here, I'm still happy with jquery.

I think one problem with jquery is that it tightly couples your classes and IDs, and your layout, which your logic. Simple example: your new dev changes layout or an ID or classname, and some code somewhere that relied on it via jquery breaks.

Yeah. Solve that with tests or a compiler.

Not using jQuery doesn’t suddenly make that problem go away.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#118

Post by eswat »

Etheryte wrote: post #42

> CSS grid > If you’re still using heavy-weight grid frameworks from UI toolkits like Bootstrap or Foundation, you are falling behind. This is a pretty sensationalist way to word this and honestly an absurd statement as a whole. If you have a public-facing site, ignoring everything that isn't up-to-date is a luxury you can't afford and blunt statements like these show ignorance in that regard.

It’s pretty sensationalist but I don’t disagree with the content of the message: by sticking with a float or flexbox-based grid system from a framework, you’re not learning the intricacies of newer tech like grid.

That being said, for most of my professional and personal work I only see grid as an incremental improvement over flex. It’s cool but time I spent learning it I could have just used what I already knew and create more things the customer actually cares about.

Re: Front End Development Topics to Learn in 2019

#119

Post by koboll »

naniwaduni wrote: post #88
cageface wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CSS grid works in IE11 with a few restrictions. Requiring IE11+ support is quite common for websites targeting the US market at least. Unless your audience is pretty unusual it's easy to make a case for excluding older browsers than this.

You can use what is, essentially, a totally different grid layout engine which works in IE11 only, but fortunately doesn't interfere too much with the more recent grid spec since everything is vendor-prefixed. It is not just "a few restrictions"; you can't even get close to a grid-based layout that works in IE10/11 by accident. It's doable, but practically, it might be a fairly reasonable decision to give up on givin…

On my own personal projects where I have the authority to make broad declarations like "IE11 is marginal enough to be served the mobile version", that works. But try explaining that to a corporate executive. The cost-benefit analysis is not really in favor of jumping to grid for most mass-market products.
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