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Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

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Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#31
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that your computer is really made of multiple computers that run bare-metal code or can have their own OSes. For example Intel CPUs have Minix running inside of them.

Some of these I knew (hard drive, LTE modem, etc.), but I didn't realize Wi-Fi was such an example.

Wi-fi adapters are some of the most processing-heavy peripherals people have.

After the memory controller, bus bridges, GPUs, and DMA controller, it's probably the largest one.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#33

Good. I hope that vulnerabilities like this continue to surface until legislators take notice. Morally bankrupt vendors will never stop locking down hardware unless governments get involved. Fuck each and every company that does this. Fuck them all to hell.

While I agree with you that vendors need to be held accountable for shipping crap, we also have to beware that we don't end up in a world of devices we cannot do anything on.

All kinds of jailbreaks, no matter if for the first generations of iPhones, for consoles, or for rooting Android devices, are based on vendors implementing shoddy security. Take it away and whoops, now we as users are fully in the death grip of what vendors and RIAA/MAFIAA allow us to do.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of these I knew (hard drive, LTE modem, etc.), but I didn't realize Wi-Fi was such an example.

Wi-fi adapters are some of the most processing-heavy peripherals people have. After the memory controller, bus bridges, GPUs, and DMA controller, it's probably the largest one.

Does processing-heavy imply it has an RTOS in it? (Do all the things you mentioned have RTOSes in them?)

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#35
post #28

Can someone please do a crowdfunding for a fully open source 802.11ac chipset and mini PCI express device? For security purposes we do not want any binary drivers, blobs, bloated boat loaders and other fancy non-security in the hardware. This is really really basic security level.

It’s hard. Cisco doesn’t even make their own WiFi chips. The cost to benefit ratio isn’t worth it.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wi-fi adapters are some of the most processing-heavy peripherals people have. After the memory controller, bus bridges, GPUs, and DMA controller, it's probably the largest one.

Does processing-heavy imply it has an RTOS in it? (Do all the things you mentioned have RTOSes in them?)

It means it has a large processor that can run an RTOS. It does not automatically mean it has an RTOS.

I would be surprised if the faster bus and memory controllers had it (because of latency problems). I would expect something like it on a USB controller, GPU, network or disk interface. I really have no idea what to expect from a DMA controller.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#37
post #28

Can someone please do a crowdfunding for a fully open source 802.11ac chipset and mini PCI express device? For security purposes we do not want any binary drivers, blobs, bloated boat loaders and other fancy non-security in the hardware. This is really really basic security level.

> Can someone please do a crowdfunding for a fully open source 802.11ac chipset and mini PCI express device?

A few RF transceivers and an FPGA like an Artix-7 (which has PCIe capability) might do the trick. It wouldn't be as cheap as a mass produced chipset, but a completely open 802.11ac chipset is unlikely to be mass produced anyway.

We already have examples of LTE base stations being run with SDR hardware like the LimeSDR, which is just an RF transceiver and an Altera FPGA, with a USB3 connection to the FPGA fabric.

In fact there are some SDR/FPGA dev kits that are Mini PCIe size and intended for use inside a laptop, specifically designed with LTE in mind[1].

So WiFi seems doable, even if you end up with a soft core CPU in the FPGA to do the same jobs WiFi chipset firmware is doing right now, at least you'd have full control over it and the firmware running on it.

[1] https://www.crowdsupply.com/fairwaves/xtrx

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#38

Good. I hope that vulnerabilities like this continue to surface until legislators take notice. Morally bankrupt vendors will never stop locking down hardware unless governments get involved. Fuck each and every company that does this. Fuck them all to hell.

While I agree with you that vendors need to be held accountable for shipping crap, we also have to beware that we don't end up in a world of devices we cannot do anything on. All kinds of jailbreaks, no matter if for the first generations of iPhones, for consoles, or for rooting Android devices, are based on vendors implementing shoddy security. Take it away and whoops, now we as users are fully in the death grip of…

we also have to beware that we don't end up in a world of devices we cannot do anything on.

IMHO it's already gotten a bit too far in that direction, and if there's no mass revolt (which is itself quite unlikely), it's only going to get worse. The old Franklin quote has never been so relevant... people these days are so highly valuing "safe" over "free", that they don't realise they're building prisons around themselves.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#39
post #28

Can someone please do a crowdfunding for a fully open source 802.11ac chipset and mini PCI express device? For security purposes we do not want any binary drivers, blobs, bloated boat loaders and other fancy non-security in the hardware. This is really really basic security level.

This is a lot harder to achieve than it sounds. Open source hardware projects that go as far as chip design - are there any of these that have been successful?

It needs a lot of money. You'd have to sell people a free virtual spaceship with the thousand-dollar tiers, maybe. And persuade people to accept higher per-unit costs than the cheap Chinese equivalents.

Re: Remotely compromise devices by using bugs in Marvell Avastar Wi-Fi

#40
post #28

Can someone please do a crowdfunding for a fully open source 802.11ac chipset and mini PCI express device? For security purposes we do not want any binary drivers, blobs, bloated boat loaders and other fancy non-security in the hardware. This is really really basic security level.

Better leverage would probably be demand side -- get a couple of major buyers (maybe for systems which can safely use older tech, like industrial or government or finance) to demand a baseline which requires open source/verifiable hardware, at least for certain systems.
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