Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which government regulation would have prevented this, exactly?
Perhaps a regulation that fined previous companies where this had happened $1000 per affected user
10 000 USD seems better IMHO
Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
171–180 of 196 posts
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#172Shouldn't this involve lots of penalties? This has the potential to change/ruin lives drastically. A prudent consumer never trusts what the companies say nowadays. However, that shouldn't absolve the company of falsely claiming private product when it isn't so.
A prudent consumer would read the terms of service.
The GDPR is proof that terms of service isn't exactly a flawless legal barrier. You can't state in a contract that "If you use our service we get to sell your personal life away" because illegalities and rights infringements cannot be inside a contract to begin with.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#173The very first words I wrote online sometime around 91 were visible for over 15 years. I pretty much don't put anything online I cannot live with.
This is a good principle in general but you didn't exactly put those words up on a site that promised "privacy/protection" did you? That's the difference here.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think everyone here is misinterpreting what I meant, and I take full responsibility for that. I think we thought of computers and the internet as our allies in privacy. They are not. They are our enemies. I think we should stop trusting computers, any computers, as much as we possibly can. Especially if you're in a minority that your government may try to punish. --- We all deserve privacy, and we are all almost co…
The problem is with the initial line of reasoning: "If you don't like x, don't do x". It's the biggest load of crap that everyone buys into for some reason. It's like saying if you don't like air pollution, move to a different location. Like yes, true, but also I want to improve the situation in my current location, not abandon it. That's how people feel on the internet, and you're asking them to throw in the towel c…
> Both of these two things are untrue, but especially the idea that technology is inherently un-private and can never be so.
I'm sorry, but I think you need to start with a list of ways you think people can use technology which has a high degree of certainty of being and remaining private.
Because I can't think of any.
Credit cards are an abomination. ISPs and wireless carriers know way too much metadata. Every social media company is a horror show. The ability to uniquely identify your browser across sites is terrifying. NSA's Carnivore. Keyloggers. Zero day exploits in the OS, in the browser, etc. Row hammer. Spectre and Meltdown. Elemental Technologies. SMS authentication and account recovery. Every online store knows way too much.
I mean, there is literally no way to even secure your IDENTITY:
https://www.wired.com/2010/05/lifelock-identity-theft/
And even if you do everything perfectly, Equifax might screw you, or Oklahoma:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2019/01/16/massi...
So, can you list maybe one or two things in technology you think are strong-guarantee secure and private?
And I'm not saying to give up. This is the fight of our lives. But right now we've LOST. We need to think about how to start over, to try to win next time.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#175The very first words I wrote online sometime around 91 were visible for over 15 years. I pretty much don't put anything online I cannot live with.
This is a good principle in general but you didn't exactly put those words up on a site that promised "privacy/protection" did you? That's the difference here.
Spot on. Let's just say I knew better. Seriously.
There was absolutely no way these companies were not going to exploit the crap out of both their position and data.
None.
How were they all built? As fast as possible, growth first, etc... I expect these kinds of things to boil down to risks and costs, ideally paid after the enterprise is big enough to deal.
And a whole lot of us know it too. How else was it all going to go?
I am a realist. There is no real privacy online. One can get close, but doing that is a lot of work, takes understanding, and is still a bit of a risk.
Long ago I realized it is better to just not put things I can't live with online.
Frankly, I won't do that electronically, unless it is very worth it.
Edit: It is all still pretty new. We are leaving the honeymoon time. Bad things will happen, so will more regulation, and that crank will get turned a few times.
My expectations are super low right now. That could change, but not yet.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think everyone here is misinterpreting what I meant, and I take full responsibility for that. I think we thought of computers and the internet as our allies in privacy. They are not. They are our enemies. I think we should stop trusting computers, any computers, as much as we possibly can. Especially if you're in a minority that your government may try to punish.
I'm actually going to reply to you twice with a similar idea. You're blatantly telling people that technology can never be trusted to be private. I just don't see why such a cynical outlook on the situation is needed, especially when it's obviously not true and the odds are not necessarily stacked against people who want privacy online or on technology.
"obviously not true"
If you want privacy, you must first have security, and no system is secure.
I mean, just for starters, there are a constant stream of zero day exploits in OSes and Browsers that would allow me to install a keylogger on your computer, completely undetected.
So why are you so anti-cynical?
The situation is dire.
I highly recommend "Daemon" and "Freedom" by Daniel Suarez, who was a Security Consultant.
Privacy is literally life and death for people. I think trying to minimize the dangers is reckless.
Cheers.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm actually going to reply to you twice with a similar idea. You're blatantly telling people that technology can never be trusted to be private. I just don't see why such a cynical outlook on the situation is needed, especially when it's obviously not true and the odds are not necessarily stacked against people who want privacy online or on technology.
"obviously not true" If you want privacy, you must first have security, and no system is secure. I mean, just for starters, there are a constant stream of zero day exploits in OSes and Browsers that would allow me to install a keylogger on your computer, completely undetected. So why are you so anti-cynical? The situation is dire. I highly recommend "Daemon" and "Freedom" by Daniel Suarez, who was a Security Consulta…
> Privacy is literally life and death for people.
This is what loses most people, because they don't think it's a big deal if someone reads their Facebook messages.
Privacy is what prevents gay people from getting purged in Chechnya[1]. Privacy is what keeps political dissidents and religious minorities out of concentration camps[2]. Privacy is what keeps our spies from being executed.
And for those who scoff at the idea of a state-level actor coming after them: privacy is what prevents someone's abusive partner from murdering them when they choose to leave the relationship[3].
[1] https://www.npr.org/2019/01/14/685192372/https://www.npr.org...
[2] https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/muslims-...
[3] https://www.theguardian.com/money/us-money-blog/2014/oct/20/...
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Everything you post on the internet is forever I wish it was. Anything on social media maybe, but the broader internet dies in ~10 years.
A lot of my forum posts from 2004 are still around. Also web archive exists meaning that all those sites are being archived even if the site hosting that content disappears.
That's not the worst of it - some of my code is still around from circa 2000. It's kinda embarrassing to read now.
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#179Just my own opinion, but at this point I think it's prudent to assume that pretty much anything you send out into the digital network world is public. If it's not something you would want the world knowing you said, don't put it out there. Security breaches happen. Bugs happen. Sometimes law enforcement just comes by and says, "Give me everything that user X has ever done." In short, sh!t happens. "Everything I do on…
This is what I have been teaching my kids and their cousins: 1) Everything you do on the internet is public 2) Everything you post on the internet is forever 3) Everything above can be traced back to you I also showed them how easy it is to save private and public snaps without sending a screenshot notification (including video!) and how easy it is to fake. It's hard to know if it's sinking in or not, but I hope so.…
I honestly don't know how Snapchat ever was able to maintain the veneer that snaps are temporary and can't come back to haunt you after they disappear. Their own users often would take screenshots, so how did the story that snaps are temporary keep getting promoted?
Re: Twitter warns that private tweets were public for years
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm actually going to reply to you twice with a similar idea. You're blatantly telling people that technology can never be trusted to be private. I just don't see why such a cynical outlook on the situation is needed, especially when it's obviously not true and the odds are not necessarily stacked against people who want privacy online or on technology.
"obviously not true" If you want privacy, you must first have security, and no system is secure. I mean, just for starters, there are a constant stream of zero day exploits in OSes and Browsers that would allow me to install a keylogger on your computer, completely undetected. So why are you so anti-cynical? The situation is dire. I highly recommend "Daemon" and "Freedom" by Daniel Suarez, who was a Security Consulta…
I think you're right in principle but too binary and extreme. You sort of make it sound like people think the internet is completely secure, and you're encouraging them to assume it's completely insecure. In reality it's more like fairly skeptical people using a secure-ish internet. If you're pretty obscure and conservative you're secure enough in practice.