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Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

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Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#81

Post by sokoloff »

harryh wrote: post #75
sokoloff wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you based on who is bringing the money to the table, but in most cases, the seller has signed a contract with the listing agent stating the fee structure for the deal before you made an offer on the house. The seller has obligated themselves to that structure, so you're not saving money by doing it yourself. I found our house entirely myself, but brought in an agent on "my" side with whom I'd negotiated…

Is there a reason you didn't do the deal without an agent and specify in your offer that you wanted the entire 3 points rebated back to you (which is kind of silly accounting, but whatever)? Certainly this would have been possible.

The contract that I signed to sell another property specified that the full commission was due from the seller regardless of buyer representation, but that any registered real estate agent working on behalf of the buyer would share equally in the commission, paid by the listing agency.

IOW, I don't think it would have been possible, as it wouldn't have been possible in my listing contract. If I thought it was possible, I'd definitely have gone that route (since 300 >> 75).

TBH, "my" agent added extremely little (it was her first closing) and may not have even been a net positive towards getting the deal to happen.

Edit: This was an existing house, not new construction.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#82

Post by gamechangr »

walrus01 wrote: post #76
gamechangr wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mother owns a residential real estate brokerage. She's siting next to me and thinks the previous post has misguided advise. She has been a broker for over 30 years. She recommends that you always ask your agent for a home inspector recommendation. "We pick the best home inspectors by the ones that performed the best in previous deals. We don't get $1 for recommendations. We wouldn't want to incase there was ever a…

Respectfully, I would ask if your mother has ever worked in a residential real estate market as overheated and bubble-like such as the metro Vancouver BC area. Shadow-flipping, assignments, double dealing have become the norm here. https://www.google.com/search?q=vancouver+real+estate+corrup...

There are many many markets. Totally agree there.

I appreciate your point. But by the same token, you are extending a reality that might be in Vancouver to all of real estate markets.

This is one of the issue that I think makes Real Estate so complexed is that it's super easy to group it together as if 200 cities are one market.

I wouldn't even know if you could group large areas together (like all agents in.... 'The South" "The west coast" "The East Coast"...do it this way.)

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#83

Post by harryh »

gamechangr wrote: post #80
harryh wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a reason you didn't do the deal without an agent and specify in your offer that you wanted the entire 3 points rebated back to you (which is kind of silly accounting, but whatever)? Certainly this would have been possible.

Curious..."how do you know "certainly this would have been possible?' Which market/city are you referencing?

certainly was perhaps too strong a word to use. How about "seemingly" ?

I guess I'm saying I don't see any reason it shouldn't have been possible.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#84

Post by [deleted] »

AtlasBarfed wrote: post #31

Realtors currently have a virtual monopoly on accessing properties in real life. That is their current cartel/guild barrier. Even a 4k tour video won't let you get a feel for a place or check out the places they didn't put on video to look for damage. Granted this service could be performed by a real estate website and they simply employ a cheaper access work force, but again you run into pro-guild red tape at the st…

[deleted]

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#85

Post by LukeWalsh »

cletus wrote: post #42

People love to complain about realtors. Companies like Redfin have been trying to disrupt this market for years. People on HN and other places like to complain that realtors are pointless and that the only reason they exist is they are entrenched. I posit a different theory, which may well be controversial here, and that is that realtors continue to exist--and charge large commissions doing so--because they provide a…

There's also an interesting aspect to a realtor that fills a guiding role. They're the person who helps turn seemingly intangible preferences into tangible search criteria (which can be executed by either party on mostly-public databases).

In fact, in the long-term, as jobs are automated, I'd expect people to spend more time, not less, on taste clarification. Then the pattern is to think about how all guiding roles in society will form to tools that automate the simple bits and let humans spend time doing what they do best. Imagine how much better it would be as a realtor to spend time in conversations inside virtual homes rather than sitting in traffic, navigating database searches, or fiddling calendars.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#86

Post by muhneesh »

AtlasBarfed wrote: post #38
muhneesh wrote: post #22

I see at least three counterpoints: 1. Real estate agents aren't often "experts" at real estate valuation, inspection or execution; They have dependencies on appraisers, inspectors, and lawyers. The work an average agent does is more or less cookie-cutter from my anecdotal experience, though I think there is a proportion of rockstar agents that do much more. 2. Not every buyer wants homebuying to be a client-services…

"Good" real estate agents are interested in moving as many houses as quickly as they can, to gain as much vig revenue as possible. "Good" real estate agents from the buyers perspective would be slowing down sales, reducing the overall price they make a percentage on anyway (which is why fixed rate for a "class" of real estate would work better) as a disincentive. Why would a real estate agent dissuade someone from bu…

Totally agree - my original post was too kind. I share your sentiment.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#87

Post by Artistry121 »

clairity wrote: post #77
ryaniscool wrote: post #33

Over the last two years I've bought a couple of properties and I see the value of realtors as professional negotiators and experts on real estate laws and contracts. That being said, the National Association of Realtors (NAR) and their local branches are the definition of a cartel. My parents owned a real estate agency when I was growing up in the 80s and 90s. Back then, the cost of selling and marketing real estate…

> "That being said, the National Association of Realtors (NAR) and their local branches are the definition of a cartel." NAR was actually investigated by the federal government (FTC i think? ), who concluded much the same, but lobbying buried the report and nothing came of it. MLS's maintain power by strictly controlling access to information. they have the most up-to-date and the most detailed information about prop…

Looks like you've got a lot going on but I'd love to learn more about your thesis and thoughts on RE. I'm working on some projects in the area.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#88

Post by gamechangr »

harryh wrote: post #83
gamechangr wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious..."how do you know "certainly this would have been possible?' Which market/city are you referencing?

certainly was perhaps too strong a word to use. How about "seemingly" ? I guess I'm saying I don't see any reason it shouldn't have been possible.

I appreciate your point and I wasn't trying to nitpick.

For some builders I would guess you would be right, though I'm not confident that all/most would though. New construction "seemingly" should allow that. Totally agree.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#89

Post by anm89 »

cletus wrote: post #42

People love to complain about realtors. Companies like Redfin have been trying to disrupt this market for years. People on HN and other places like to complain that realtors are pointless and that the only reason they exist is they are entrenched. I posit a different theory, which may well be controversial here, and that is that realtors continue to exist--and charge large commissions doing so--because they provide a…

I'm in the process of selling right now and I can assure you you are wrong. I got a realtor out of fear that I would be missing out on buyers simply as a punishment for not going through the realtor system. After getting astonishingly little value out of the realtor for what would have been an almost 10k seller fee, I fired them and I did a flat fee listing service, and I'm seeing about the exact same foot traffic.

I have still left the 10k buyers agent fee because you will DEFINITELY be blacklisted by the buyer side agents if you don't pay their fee. So basically I'm paying 10k in cartel bribes to get my house shown to people who could have easily found it on their own on zillow or redfin.

The only reason people are going through agents is out of fair of being screwed over by agents who will push them out.

Re: Zillow CEO: startups trying to disrupt real estate commissions will fail (2012)

#90

Post by ams6110 »

clairity wrote: post #77
ryaniscool wrote: post #33

Over the last two years I've bought a couple of properties and I see the value of realtors as professional negotiators and experts on real estate laws and contracts. That being said, the National Association of Realtors (NAR) and their local branches are the definition of a cartel. My parents owned a real estate agency when I was growing up in the 80s and 90s. Back then, the cost of selling and marketing real estate…

> "That being said, the National Association of Realtors (NAR) and their local branches are the definition of a cartel." NAR was actually investigated by the federal government (FTC i think? ), who concluded much the same, but lobbying buried the report and nothing came of it. MLS's maintain power by strictly controlling access to information. they have the most up-to-date and the most detailed information about prop…

Property transfers, including buyer, seller, and sales price, are public record. It's all published in the newspaper. How can MLS control access to that information? Is it just that nobody else bothers to compile it from the county records?
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