A few years ago, one of the best managers I ever worked for left to become the CTO of a company doing pattern analysis of network traffic, rather than Deep Packet Inspection. The premise was that most of the internet traffic on your network follows the same typical patterns, but nefarious traffic doesn't. Drop their system into the network and voila, you can start to find the weird things going on that seem out of th…
Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
91–100 of 126 posts
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#92Earlier quoted context omitted.
TVs have had software for decades. The fact that we're finally using "software update" and "TV" together is a long time coming, and finally a security model we can work with.
yes, but not connected for the most part.
Don't make the mistake of thinking you are a representative of all customers. YOU may not care about connectivity, but others, many others, do.
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
Agreed. It's not even the TV that needs access to Internet. What if you have one of the Roku, Apple TV, Chromecast, etc devices that stream content from the Internet? Without those we might as well go back to storing content locally which let's face it - is mostly retrieved quasi-legally through BitTorrent.
yeah, while that's true, a manufacture like amazon or apple is much more likely to update your device since they are still hoping to sell you content. You think your offbrand Smart TV is going to update past a couple bugs? They already made all the money they are going to make off that TV and they are done. Still have to trust the manufacture for that to work, but at lease you're not just left wide open there. (I mea…
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#94Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course, this means the packet inspection host and the organisation's internal CA are now great targets to attack. This approach puts all the eggs in a single central basket.
IMO relying 100% on the end devices to protect themselves is too risky. Layered security seems to work best. Also I prefer to heavily monitor/secure two appliances/systems than heavily monitor thousands of end devices
It can't be both at once. Either you have multiple layers because both the appliance and the endpoints are independently secure and the attacker has to compromise both, or you don't monitor/secure the individual endpoints and the appliances become a single layer / single point of compromise.
And if the appliances can see all the plaintext of everything then they're a single point of compromise even if the endpoints are otherwise secure, because the attacker can still read all the secrets through the man-in-the-middlebox.
What works is to leave each thing to what it's good at. The endpoints are good at inspecting the plaintext, because they inherently have to have it anyway and they have the context to understand what it's supposed to look like. So you don't end up interfering with a newer, more secure protocol because the middlebox doesn't understand it. And plaintext is sensitive data so the fewer things that have access to it the fewer things you can compromise to get access to it.
What middleboxes are really good at is certain types of access control, e.g. blacklisting malicious IP addresses for outgoing connections, or whitelisting source and destination addresses and ports for incoming connections. They keep your local IP cameras off the internet even if the cameras "should" be secure on their own.
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#95Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Really, my issue is stuff on my own network. I want to see what my TV sends home. Same with an amazon-echo, or really any IoT thing. I'm with you 100%. The reality is, though, your only choice is to not run those devices with access to the internet. A TV should not require internet access to be usable. I won't use an Echo, and IoT devices are isolated to their own internal network without WAN access.
Your definition of a usable TV is outdated.
My whole point in my post is that I don't want devices that I cannot look into and control. Unfortunately that's become incredibly difficult if not impossible. Personally, the line I've drawn does not include my TV. it's not that important to me to have an integrated TV system that I can't control.
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#96It's not dead. Encryption has (unjustifiably) pushed the enterprise to install fake catchall certificates on proxies so they can snoop plain-text traffic. (Why anyone would ever think this is a good idea is beyond me.)
How else are you going to catch APT (Advanced Persistent Threat) data exfiltration/control channel traffic? Assumption 1: Machines on your network are already compromised and fully owned by a sophisticated and extremely difficult to detect rootkit. This is true of every large business. There is always that guy who will click on any link or open the document from what appears to be their co-worker. Assumption 2: APT t…
Which is another reason why DPI is ineffective. The smart malware will identify when its connection is presenting a custom root certificate rather than the expected one and not proceed with its suspicious activities (if not deploy some kind of steganography). Then the same "that guy" will plug his personal phone into his computer, and now the malware has an unmonitored cellular data connection to the outside on a machine that's also connected to the internal network. Or a compromised laptop will hook up to the WiFi of the company on the adjacent floor or the coffee shop next door, or the user connects it to the coffee shop WiFi when they're in the coffee shop.
In theory you can build a Faraday cage around your space and then strip-search employees for digital devices at the door, but if your data is that important then you probably ought to just not be connected to the internet at all.
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#97Earlier quoted context omitted.
yes, but not connected for the most part.
Yes, with fewer features. Don't make the mistake of thinking you are a representative of all customers. YOU may not care about connectivity, but others, many others, do.
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#98A few years ago, one of the best managers I ever worked for left to become the CTO of a company doing pattern analysis of network traffic, rather than Deep Packet Inspection. The premise was that most of the internet traffic on your network follows the same typical patterns, but nefarious traffic doesn't. Drop their system into the network and voila, you can start to find the weird things going on that seem out of th…
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#99Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, with fewer features. Don't make the mistake of thinking you are a representative of all customers. YOU may not care about connectivity, but others, many others, do.
Yes, but the right way to do this is to get a separate device for the connectivity part, in order to protect yourself against services having much shorter lifetime than hardware. Techies knows this, and customers who got burned on smart TVs know this too. Regular people don't always realize this, but companies pushing smart TVs know this perfectly well . This is pretty obvious planned obsolescence. In my eyes, it's s…
Security isn't about being perfect, so stop pushing that false narrative. It's about being good enough, and plenty of companies making smart TVs can certainly become "good enough".
Re: Deep packet inspection is dead, and here's why (2017)
#100Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, but the right way to do this is to get a separate device for the connectivity part, in order to protect yourself against services having much shorter lifetime than hardware. Techies knows this, and customers who got burned on smart TVs know this too. Regular people don't always realize this, but companies pushing smart TVs know this perfectly well . This is pretty obvious planned obsolescence. In my eyes, it's s…
Techies don't "know" this, I want to be abundantly clear that having a technical background doesn't make you more savvy to security concerns -- if this were true, the prevalence of security problems throughout the industry wouldn't be nearly as pervasive. Security isn't about being perfect, so stop pushing that false narrative. It's about being good enough, and plenty of companies making smart TVs can certainly becom…