As someone not from the US how could you be compelled to unlock your device using biometrics? Does this actually involve violence?
Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
161–170 of 294 posts
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#162As if a court order ever stopped a highly motivated group of people from using technology however they wanted, with or without either your consent or the consent of the company providing the technology platform ...
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#163As someone not from the US how could you be compelled to unlock your device using biometrics? Does this actually involve violence?
INAL but I believe its usually contempt of court, you'll be locked up til you comply.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#164As if a court order ever stopped a highly motivated group of people from using technology however they wanted, with or without either your consent or the consent of the company providing the technology platform ...
Actually court orders do that all the time. Sure, it can't stop physical force being used but it can invalidate the results for legal purposes.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
It won't stand because it's not pragmatic. The issue around 'passwords being in your mind' is interesting, but they'll move past it. If you have evidence of a crime on your phone, it must be part of the process. There's nothing remotely unlawful about search of property so long as there is merit, oversight, warrant etc.. Ultimately, this will be no different than searching your car. Now, the cops doing it without a w…
It will be interesting what happens at airports. Nominally, the reason they check your bag at the airport is for security. But in the process they can find all sorts of other stuff that isn't dangerous to fly with but is illegal, e.g. marijuana. So the whole thing becomes an avenue to warrantless search. You can't make the same argument about a computer or phone -- you can't bring down a plane or hurt anyone by havin…
How does TSA know your giant laptop is really a laptop and not a bomb inside a laptop case? One indicator is whether it powers up and you can log into it. (I'm not saying I love that answer, but it's a better indicator than just popping up a backlit lock screen [which could be a sheet of acetate with a fixed image])
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#166Earlier quoted context omitted.
It won't stand because it's not pragmatic. The issue around 'passwords being in your mind' is interesting, but they'll move past it. If you have evidence of a crime on your phone, it must be part of the process. There's nothing remotely unlawful about search of property so long as there is merit, oversight, warrant etc.. Ultimately, this will be no different than searching your car. Now, the cops doing it without a w…
Aren't you confusing property with ideas? I agree, the physical phone itself should be part of discovery. Authorities should be allowed to physically disassemble the phone and inspect its insides or run forensic tests on it. The content on the phone is a matter of interpretation, subject to proper decryption. It is just an idea, no different from decoding ideas in somebody's journal. It makes no sense to talk about d…
1's and 0's representing words are the same thing as ink blots in the form of characters representing words.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
Let’s hope the Supreme Court hears it and it stands.
It won't stand because it's not pragmatic. The issue around 'passwords being in your mind' is interesting, but they'll move past it. If you have evidence of a crime on your phone, it must be part of the process. There's nothing remotely unlawful about search of property so long as there is merit, oversight, warrant etc.. Ultimately, this will be no different than searching your car. Now, the cops doing it without a w…
I think you need to read the court opinion, because you're only addressing one half of it. There's a 5th amendment aspect too and that's a lot harder to overcome.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#168As someone not from the US how could you be compelled to unlock your device using biometrics? Does this actually involve violence?
Aren’t all laws ultimately backed by threat of force whether to take your property or imprison you (not sure I’d call this violence)? You can be held in contempt if you ignore a court order but I doubt they would like smash your thumb down on the screen.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
The comment you replied to pointed out that they are voluntary.
Voluntary is the sense of someone(s) in a position of authority or power asking if you're willing to submit to a voluntary procedure. I've be interviewed by police twice after being charged with crimes that carry potential prison sentences. The interviews are voluntary in the sense you're not required to answer any of the questions, and I could have chosen to wait in a cell for my lawyer to turn up days later ... but…
Absolutely you could have waited for a lawyer. You voluntarily decided not to.
"voluntary" - done, given, or acting of one's own free will. You said yourself that you could have waited, but decided not to.
Alternatively you could have just done a "no comment" interview, which - let's be honest - is what the lawyer would have advised you to do, no matter if you're guilty or not.
Re: Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules
#170This nice and all in theory but looking through the lens of reality where police are legally allowed to lie to get a confession - claiming they have evidence that they don’t have to coerce a confession and seeing that “rubber hose decryption” is real, it really doesn’t mean much in practice. Edit: Since people don’t seem to believe that police are actually legally allowed to lie during an interrogation: https://www.n…
Police are absolutely allowed to lie during an interrogation. I’ve seen it done multiple times. The most disturbing interrogation I’ve ever seen was actually the one where a teenager murdered his own father while under the influence of magic mushrooms. He was taken into the interrogation room shortly after the murder but enough time had elapsed that he was sober and just starting to understand the gravity of what he…
I have seen that interrogation video and I have no problem with her asking questions in a caring and patient way. In fact I would prefer all interrogations were like that one.
There are many, many, much worse examples.
The first one that comes to mind to me is when they interviewed that simple guy on the Netflix show, Making a Murderer. They basically told him everything would be ok if he just admitted to murdering someone, and prompted every detail by just badgering him. He had no idea how serious the charges were that he was admitting to, and clearly had no idea of the details of the murder until they prompted him. I'm sure he should have had a lawyer or guardian helping him, as you would with a child.
He's still in jail AFAIK.