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China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

washingtonpost.com

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Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#191

Post by JumpCrisscross »

pseudolus wrote: post #189
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> judges in the US routinely use sentencing as a means to do the same American judges are fiercely independent. Where “messaging” is concerned it’s within the context of deterring future crime, not messaging to foreign states.

Not as independent as you would believe. The number of applications judges actually refuse for search warrants and wiretaps is miniscule. All too often they act merely as extensions for police departments.

> All too often [judges[ act merely as extensions for police departments

Empirical data disagrees with your assertion [1]. Judges act as an effective check on prosecutors. There are systemic issues which mitigate this check, e.g. cash bail and plea bargaining. But the difference between America and China in judicial independence and prosecution procedure is night and day.

[1] https://scholarship.law.cornell.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?arti...

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#192

Post by scrumper »

stochastic_monk wrote: post #185
scrumper wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A message of solidarity, which when you unwrap it contains a subtle threat.

How subtle a threat is a death sentence?

It's interpretable as a subtle threat to Yang. The message looks on the surface like solidarity: "We'll step up tensions over your arrest. We're on your side. Hang tight." But really, it says, "We have no issues whatsoever with judicial murder so keep your mouth shut." It's not like Canada is going to release her to get a convicted drug smuggler out of jail after all.

Maybe it is not so subtle!

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#193

Post by advertising »

mikeash wrote: post #28
CydeWeys wrote: post #4

At this point I think I'm too afraid to ever go to China. You can't get justice there, and you can be swept up into some stupid diplomatic spat. Don't they realize how short-sighted this is? This is incredibly harmful to tourism.

He was already a convicted drug trafficker. I don’t see any indication that his original 15-year sentence was improper. It is possible that he was falsely convicted, of course, but I don’t know that this is more likely in China than elsewhere. Suddenly changing his sentence to death is rather suspicious, but at least for me it doesn’t make a huge difference compared to a 15-year sentence. Random anecdote: I just got…

This is something that has really irked me the past couple years. I feel safer entering other countries than I do coming back to the U.S.

It feels like you’re entering a prison camp going through immigration. Everyone is screened by security before getting on a plane yet passport control officers are wearing swat team bullet proof vests and open-carry guns while checking your passport.

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#194

Post by pupppet »

mikeash wrote: post #28
CydeWeys wrote: post #4

At this point I think I'm too afraid to ever go to China. You can't get justice there, and you can be swept up into some stupid diplomatic spat. Don't they realize how short-sighted this is? This is incredibly harmful to tourism.

He was already a convicted drug trafficker. I don’t see any indication that his original 15-year sentence was improper. It is possible that he was falsely convicted, of course, but I don’t know that this is more likely in China than elsewhere. Suddenly changing his sentence to death is rather suspicious, but at least for me it doesn’t make a huge difference compared to a 15-year sentence. Random anecdote: I just got…

>Suddenly changing his sentence to death is rather suspicious, but at least for me it doesn’t make a huge difference compared to a 15-year sentence.

I'm guessing going from 15 years to death sentence is probably a big difference to him.

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#195

Post by foldr »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #174
foldr wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If we start banning Chinese phones we'll buy American ones come in instead. Which American phones are these? The iPhone isn't made in the US, it's made by Foxconn.

Most of the IP/software and profit in an iPhone comes from and goes to a US company. Most of the components in an iPhone aren’t from China (nor the USA). Yes, it is assembled in China, but it isn’t accurate to say it is a Chinese product.

There's not much you can do with the IP if China stops being willing to make the product for you. (Unless the IP is so far ahead of the competition you can sell it, but Chinese phone manufacturers are making phones that are very competitive with iPhones.)

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#196

Post by gpm »

magduf wrote: post #173
3pt14159 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Either China is doing this so they can have something to retreat on that seems gracious and careful (i.e., it's a complete ploy) or they're completely misreading Canadian sentiment. Canadians tend to give and give and bend and bend, but it really comes to it they snap in a way that I don't think the Chinese understand. We have way more leverage over China than they have over us. We sell them commodities. They sell us…

>If we start banning Chinese phones we'll buy American ones come in instead. Huh? America doesn't make any phones, and worse, simply does not even have the technology to make phones if they wanted to. America does not have the technology needed to make the screens for them, most notably: the screen technology is all in Asia.

Isn't a good portion of screen technology in Sourth Korea though, which is more of a US ally than a Chinese one?

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#197

Post by seanmcdirmid »

foldr wrote: post #195
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the IP/software and profit in an iPhone comes from and goes to a US company. Most of the components in an iPhone aren’t from China (nor the USA). Yes, it is assembled in China, but it isn’t accurate to say it is a Chinese product.

There's not much you can do with the IP if China stops being willing to make the product for you. (Unless the IP is so far ahead of the competition you can sell it, but Chinese phone manufacturers are making phones that are very competitive with iPhones.)

Even the Chinese phone manufacturers rely on American software (Android), even if Google gives that away.

If China refused to assemble iPhones for Apple, that assembly could easily be shifted somewhere else: the components are mostly not from China and even the machinery used to assemble the iPhones is mostly German. Apple/Foxconn do it in China because it is the best deal ATM, and shift iPhone assembly around as needed easily (eg iPhones are assembled in Brazil, and will be in India to get around tariffs).

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#198

Post by irrational »

magduf wrote: post #173
3pt14159 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Either China is doing this so they can have something to retreat on that seems gracious and careful (i.e., it's a complete ploy) or they're completely misreading Canadian sentiment. Canadians tend to give and give and bend and bend, but it really comes to it they snap in a way that I don't think the Chinese understand. We have way more leverage over China than they have over us. We sell them commodities. They sell us…

>If we start banning Chinese phones we'll buy American ones come in instead. Huh? America doesn't make any phones, and worse, simply does not even have the technology to make phones if they wanted to. America does not have the technology needed to make the screens for them, most notably: the screen technology is all in Asia.

It doesn't have the technology or the manufacturing capability?

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#199

Post by dwild »

jdhn wrote: post #7
b88d80170 wrote: post #3

If he is not Canadian, would it be different for such drug case?

Maybe, maybe not. I do believe that if he wasn't Canadian, we wouldn't be hearing about it.

> Maybe, maybe not. I do believe that if he wasn't Canadian, we wouldn't be hearing about it.

For sure and the same is true before Huawei arrest. This has nothing to do with his case but with how China use Canadian in their country to threaten us (I'm Canadian).

Re: China sentences Canadian man to death in drug case linked to Huawei row

#200

Post by kingofpandora »

zrobotics wrote: post #169
treis wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Foxconn is Taiwanese not Chinese. Most of their manufacturing is in China so I'm not sure how much that distinction matters in this scenario but I thought it helpful to clarify.

Note that, as far as China is concerned, Taiwan is a part of China. So from their perspective that is even less of a useful distiction. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-China_policy

It's a very useful distinction because de facto Taiwan is not part of China.
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