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The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

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Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#121

Post by mac01021 »

forkLding wrote: post #19
CptFribble wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the primacy of individualism/freedoms as the only path to collective prosperity? Like, what if the Chinese model really is the best way to run a country (not an endorsement, btw)? Not "taboo," persay, but it's something thing that's not really seriously considered by most westerners (not the ones I know, at least).

Then you might like Han Song https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_Song_(writer)

Any of his works in particular? (Sadly, it looks from the wikipedia article like I'm not likely to find an english translation for most of his work)

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#122

Post by tanilama »

laacz wrote: post #115
tanilama wrote: post #84

Chinese book market, or fiction market has now almost fully embraced digital self-publishing. Magazine are now almost dead, books are just physical copies of their online version. Sad but true, the one most important Chinese SF magazine, the SF World, where all the mentioned authors started their career, has been hanging on the edge and gradually becoming irrelevant for some time now. The new generation of readers ha…

Isn't it that what's a strangling market in China, actually is good enough for its members to strive? All the readership numbers considered. I'd argue that a niche in China is enough to sustain itself.

I don't know really. China is a huge. But a shrinking market for a genre that isn't big in the first place isn't a good sign while other mediums are blooming. It makes it harder to attract new blood and vitality into this system.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#123

Post by NeedMoreTea »

blackrock wrote: post #103
Jerry2 wrote: post #34

Cixin Liu's 'Remembrance of Earth’s Past' trilogy are the greatest sci-fi books I've ever read. I still remember when I picked the first volume and than patiently waited for a very long time for translations of the next books to arrive. The wait was well worth it. He manages to put his characters into seemingly insurmountable situations and it feels like he won't be able to write his way out of them but somehow he ma…

I think it depends on what you want out of it. In western sci-fi, the story exists to make the reader feel good about themselves. At least, the successful ones are like this. It makes for good movies, and good story telling. Think about that for a moment. All the western sci-fi that we've been used to: Star Wars, Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, etc.. All these stories are not really science fiction, but rather, scie…

I don't think the cliche Hollywood ending that presents the feel good about yourself, happy resolution, complete with positive family messages at the end of absolutely sodding everything is anything to do with good story telling. It's just the very tired Hollywood cliche that's proven time and again can draw an American family audience.

It's not an either/or. Books are often much, much darker than Hollywood adaptations.

Why is a US programme such as Breaking Bad considered ground breaking and hugely refreshing? For the first time in decades the USA has produced something where the hero is also the bad guy. You end up with some sympathy, and conflicted, for a complex main character, with many shades of grey and black. None of the usual black/white, so obvious it's painful.

Something like Stross's Merchant Princes can finish with a horrible ending and still be a fabulous series and story telling without many reasons to feel good to be found. Then derail after those 6 brilliant books with a clumsy reboot/relaunch.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#124

Post by oblio »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #123
blackrock wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends on what you want out of it. In western sci-fi, the story exists to make the reader feel good about themselves. At least, the successful ones are like this. It makes for good movies, and good story telling. Think about that for a moment. All the western sci-fi that we've been used to: Star Wars, Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, etc.. All these stories are not really science fiction, but rather, scie…

I don't think the cliche Hollywood ending that presents the feel good about yourself, happy resolution, complete with positive family messages at the end of absolutely sodding everything is anything to do with good story telling. It's just the very tired Hollywood cliche that's proven time and again can draw an American family audience. It's not an either/or. Books are often much, much darker than Hollywood adaptatio…

> It's just the very tired Hollywood cliche that's proven time and again can draw an American family audience.

Global family audience. They're doing something right.

As big as China is getting and will get in the future, I wonder if their movie industry will ever become a global draw. They seem to be awfully local right now. Same goes for Japan or even India.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#125

Post by NeedMoreTea »

hinkley wrote: post #73
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found just the opposite. I thought the first book was OK, but definitely not great. I thought the second and third atrocious, and a couple of the least memorable books I've ever read. I didn't finish the third. I wouldn't had started it had I not bought the set. I couldn't understand the appeal or relate to them at all. That said, I'm glad they exist, it's refreshing after so much copy-cat blandness in today's publ…

I wouldn't say attrocious but the third one isn't holding my attention. I don't want to know what happens next, I just want to know what happens at the end. Meanwhile, I'm really bummed that the last book of the Expanse got delayed 4 months. I don't know how they're going to wrap up the story line in only one more book.

Maybe a tad harsh. Then again, that lack of memorability means my main memory of the series is the first had rough edges but enough potential to want to start the second, but I retain barely anything of the story.

Mind, I'm getting rather jaded with many series and trilogies, though I also want to see how the Expanse finishes up. A trilogy seems to have become the current expectation (from publishers perhaps?) where too often just a book or two would fit the story much better.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#126

Post by hnaccy »

blackrock wrote: post #103
Jerry2 wrote: post #34

Cixin Liu's 'Remembrance of Earth’s Past' trilogy are the greatest sci-fi books I've ever read. I still remember when I picked the first volume and than patiently waited for a very long time for translations of the next books to arrive. The wait was well worth it. He manages to put his characters into seemingly insurmountable situations and it feels like he won't be able to write his way out of them but somehow he ma…

I think it depends on what you want out of it. In western sci-fi, the story exists to make the reader feel good about themselves. At least, the successful ones are like this. It makes for good movies, and good story telling. Think about that for a moment. All the western sci-fi that we've been used to: Star Wars, Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, etc.. All these stories are not really science fiction, but rather, scie…

Your post is a bit dismissive given your familiarity with western sci-fi seems to extend only to incredibly popular film series.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#127

Post by andygates »

aerophilic wrote: post #25
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Liu Cixin already covers this in his well-known trilogy. Also, Folding Beijing is an award winning short story encompassing all three things plus class strife, written by a Chinese author.

One thing I really appreciated about the three body problem (Liu Cixin), was the “completely different perspective” brought to bear. I feel to often with (American) science fiction, you have well known and “expected” themes. What will be interesting is how much further they can go. I personally prefer a “wealth” of perspectives, and you can only get that if people are coming from different cultures.

This is one of the reasons I devoured the trilogy and started looking for more: a whole different set of expectations and norms that are subtly different. I think scifi audiences might be primed for that?

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#128

Post by dominicr »

twelfthnight wrote: post #50
Jerry2 wrote: post #34

Cixin Liu's 'Remembrance of Earth’s Past' trilogy are the greatest sci-fi books I've ever read. I still remember when I picked the first volume and than patiently waited for a very long time for translations of the next books to arrive. The wait was well worth it. He manages to put his characters into seemingly insurmountable situations and it feels like he won't be able to write his way out of them but somehow he ma…

'Remembrance of Earth’s Past' trilogy is spectacular. At the risk of this becoming a list of everyone's favorite novels, I'd put the Hyperion Cantos by Dan Simmons in the same league as that trilogy.

Good comparison, in that there were chapters in both sets of books that I had to persevere through. But that paid off in the Hyperion Cantos but unfortunately I never felt the reward was worth the work for Remembrance of Earth.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#129

Post by forkLding »

tanilama wrote: post #122
laacz wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it that what's a strangling market in China, actually is good enough for its members to strive? All the readership numbers considered. I'd argue that a niche in China is enough to sustain itself.

I don't know really. China is a huge. But a shrinking market for a genre that isn't big in the first place isn't a good sign while other mediums are blooming. It makes it harder to attract new blood and vitality into this system.

I actually read Chinese sci-fi light novels, although a lot of it is trash, there are good ones that come out.

I think with traditional publishing, it's hard to get your book in but easier once you get in. Whereas with self-publishing on the web, it's easier to get in but harder to maintain because of the many demands from readers.

Re: The Rise and Rise of Chinese Science Fiction

#130

Post by dominicr »

mercutio2 wrote: post #41
Jerry2 wrote: post #34

Cixin Liu's 'Remembrance of Earth’s Past' trilogy are the greatest sci-fi books I've ever read. I still remember when I picked the first volume and than patiently waited for a very long time for translations of the next books to arrive. The wait was well worth it. He manages to put his characters into seemingly insurmountable situations and it feels like he won't be able to write his way out of them but somehow he ma…

Wow. I couldn’t stand the first book of this series. Interminable, I never built any empathy for any of the characters. I’ve been told it gets better after the first book, but why would I subject myself to another book after my experience of the first? Anyway, to each their own, but as a huge sci-fi fan, I generally love the Hugo winners and nominees. The Chinese sci-fi that’s been nominated has all left me cold.

Same for me.

From reading only a few Chinese/Asian books I think the problem is that each culture has its own style of writing fiction and Chinese books tend to have a slower pace and more introspection. You also get that in some English language fiction, but not so much in sci-fi, so the average English culture sci-fi reader is going to going to get frustrated with Chinese language sci.fi.

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