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Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

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Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#21
post #5

Kind of interesting distribution is kind of like darknet geocaching. I wonder how much accidental discovery occurs.

The other issue I see is at some point, all secret hiding spaces will be used. For a consumer, checking previous drop locations may result in finding free goods.

If this becomes big business then every retail store will start providing airport locker type storage.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#22
How do you defend against the eye in the sky, video surveillance or location tracking ? There seems to be conflicting objectives. When hiding an object you don't want too many people around to see where you hide it. Yet if you record only two person going to exactly the same non standard spot it's pretty much a red flag, then you follow the person in the recording to identify them. Most buildings are probably not valid because they can't be entered easily by both parties.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#23
post #3

I wonder if dark web markets will ever establish a comprehensive alternative parcel system... that seems like the natural, final extension of these ideas. The technical challenges to this would of course be significant (I'll refrain from listing them and suggesting potential workarounds since I don't really want to give anybody any specific ideas on this LOL)

There are quite a few holes in the scheme as outlined in the article. The author asserts that dead drops are better than post office boxes because they're harder to surveil, but what keeps law enforcement from signing up their own personnel as distributors? Then it's just a matter of staking out their own dead drop and arresting whoever shows up. This is why the first rule of opsec has always been, "Involve as few pe…

The interesting thing about dead drops is that they are asymmetric, because whoever chooses the dead drop location has first-mover advantage. So, they are harder to surveil for an outsider, but easier for an insider - who can also involve third parties in a distributed way, similar to how the exchanges themselves happen. The article gets into this when it discusses how sellers might adapt to the possibility of a middle-man stealing from the dead-drop, or a supplier surveiling them.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#24
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>As interesting as it all is, it's also very concerning for Law Enforcement. it seems better from their perspective than street gangs shooting each other over turf imo. an improvement for everyone involved, frankly. >How do you make sure the product gets to your support layers? through dead drops, of course ;)

if the darkweb resolves the drug on war issue .. that will be something

Unlikely. It just decentralizes distribution and dealing - bulk darkweb drugs still end up in the hands of street resellers.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#25
The elephant in the room that this article highlights, but never addresses.

A mobile phone has become a de facto a requirement for illegal commerce, as described, and to me presents a pretty huge single point of failure.

And yes, I know, EVERYBODY has a phone. But I don't. Why would I want to carry a police officer in my pocket? Especially if I'm a criminal.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#27

How do you defend against the eye in the sky, video surveillance or location tracking ? There seems to be conflicting objectives. When hiding an object you don't want too many people around to see where you hide it. Yet if you record only two person going to exactly the same non standard spot it's pretty much a red flag, then you follow the person in the recording to identify them. Most buildings are probably not val…

Yeah, it's a great story, but machine vision + machine learning + surveillance could pull the rug out from the dropgangs market in a second.

But really, other than this fatal flaw, it's a great narrative of the internet spilling into and interfacing with analog markets

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other issue I see is at some point, all secret hiding spaces will be used. For a consumer, checking previous drop locations may result in finding free goods.

If this becomes big business then every retail store will start providing airport locker type storage.

In a known, easily watched location?

Did you read the article?

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#29

The elephant in the room that this article highlights, but never addresses. A mobile phone has become a de facto a requirement for illegal commerce, as described, and to me presents a pretty huge single point of failure. And yes, I know, EVERYBODY has a phone. But I don't. Why would I want to carry a police officer in my pocket? Especially if I'm a criminal.

Dead drops don't require a phone, only something to take a photo of the hiding place.

Re: Dropgangs, or the future of darknet markets

#30

How do you defend against the eye in the sky, video surveillance or location tracking ? There seems to be conflicting objectives. When hiding an object you don't want too many people around to see where you hide it. Yet if you record only two person going to exactly the same non standard spot it's pretty much a red flag, then you follow the person in the recording to identify them. Most buildings are probably not val…

I predict complex urban drop points in subways or steam tunnels to compensate.
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