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Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

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Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#151

Post by atr_gz »

vanattab wrote: post #88

Ask HN: Is anyone here happy with Google Fi service? I ordered a Pixel 3 phone directly from Google Fi and signed up for service with Google Fi the end of December. When I ordered the phone it showed up as in stock and estimated I would get my phone by the 4th of January. On the 2nd I got an email saying that the phone shipping was delayed and I would receive an email when it ships. I have heard nothing from google s…

I like it. Support had been fast and helpful, and it's hard to beat for international travel. I've used it in 5 countries with good speeds (although I've mostly been in cities). And as an added bonus it gets around the firewall in China. I've seen people try TMobile here and it's definitely slower than Fi, although it also gets around the firewall.

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#152

Post by piyush_soni »

wtmt wrote: post #110
piyush_soni wrote: post #44

How people's sentiments change here based on who tries to protect their privacy. If it's Apple, "wow, they are god's own people with purest intentions of protecting users' privacy". When Google does it : "Yeah, because they want to sell it themselves so obviously they don't want any competition".

That's pretty easy to conclude based on the business models of said companies. Why would anyone want to reach a different conclusion, especially when Google has shown apathy towards location data collection on Android, bypassing Safari's cookie handling to track users, etc.? The writing on the wall is crystal clear.

Apple was caught storing iphone users' location history in plain text! What are we talking here?

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#153

Post by warent »

Johnny555 wrote: post #101
warent wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I was going to say... Of course Google made this demand. It's a no-brainer. Not only does it help ensure their competitors aren't profiting from the same data that Google does, but also its a beautiful PR stunt. Not to say that they shouldn't be making this demand, but we should all keep in mind that they're not doing this out of the kindness of their hearts or because it's the ethical thing to do.

also its a beautiful PR stunt. It's only a PR stunt if they publicized it -- it's not a stunt if they did it without making it public. It's a PR win for sure, but that doesn't make it a PR stunt.

That's fair, I couldn't think of the term "PR Win" and chose the next closest thing to communicate what I wanted, but knew it was slightly off. Thanks for the correction

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#154

Post by rapind »

ariwilson wrote: post #74
Despegar wrote: post #2

I mean sure. Google certainly doesn't want wireless carriers to compete with them in advertising, and everyone having access to location data from smartphones just devalues Google's own access. https://qz.com/1131515/google-collects-android-users-locatio...

Your comment doesn't make any sense. Wireless carriers will always have access to location (based on cell towers) and don't have successful advertising businesses.

Verizon own Yahoo and AOL (Verizon Media). AT&T owns Warner Media.

In Canada our two major wireless providers (oligarch) own most of the content providers as well.

These giants are most definitely involved in advertising at some level.

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#155

Post by pdimitar »

piyush_soni wrote: post #152
wtmt wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's pretty easy to conclude based on the business models of said companies. Why would anyone want to reach a different conclusion, especially when Google has shown apathy towards location data collection on Android, bypassing Safari's cookie handling to track users, etc.? The writing on the wall is crystal clear.

Apple was caught storing iphone users' location history in plain text! What are we talking here?

Source?

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#156

Post by taneq »

vkou wrote: post #131
lancesells wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What harm can I inflict to you, via targeted ads? Some. You can think of some creative ways to do so, but it's not a very effective way to inflict harm. Do you see how people have weaponized social media through data? Google ads might not have been used in a nefarious way just yet but that's likely because it hasn't been thought of.

With ratings, on a scale of one to ten, how would you compare the individual harm of someone showing you a demographic-targeted ad[1], to someone having the real-time location data sufficient to start physically stalking you? What about someone showing you an untargeted ad? Where would that fit in? [1] Or, if you prefer, a remarketing ad, instead. I have very little patience for those.

The harm to me isn't the harm of someone showing me a demographic-targeted ad, the harm is someone showing everyone demographic-targeted ads designed to manipulate public opinion.

Remember how everyone got very hot and bothered about precisely this thing happening in a recent U.S. election?

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#157

Post by piyush_soni »

pdimitar wrote: post #155
piyush_soni wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple was caught storing iphone users' location history in plain text! What are we talking here?

Source?

Here : The location data was stored unencrypted on the device and most users didn't even know about it ! - http://radar.oreilly.com/2011/04/apple-location-tracking.htm...

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#158

Post by beavisthegenius »

mgleason_3 wrote: post #150
notatoad wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bounty hunter can't call up Google and get access to my location. If i were on T-Mobile or Sprint, they could[1]. This is not a theoretical difference. Being concerned about how Google could potentially in the future abuse all the data they've collected is a completely valid concern, but they're in no way a larger threat than the companies currently actively exploiting that data. https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/…

Right? And why is everyone talking about how bad Google is when AT&T, Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint are selling our freaking location?!? It's nuts! If it's easier to become a bounty hunter than a barber in Idaho, then almost anyone can track someones location without their knowledge. Odds are the data's being made available in other ways we're not even aware of. And think about the impact on battered wives, someone o…

Verizon stopped.

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#159

Post by thefounder »

vkou wrote: post #65
thefounder wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as the advertising is concerned Google is no different(and so FB etc). Anyone with few bucks will know your location or better said will target you with ads. With Google they won't target only by location because as you said Google makes the OS so it knows pretty much everything about you.

Please show me where I can buy thefounder's location data from Google. Which service is that, and how much do I need to pay? I can't find it at https://www.google.com/about/products/ > better said will target you with ads. The difference between selling location data, and selling ad targeting, is the difference between actively stalking someone, and sending unsolicited spam to "Current resident" at "Every address in…

Unless you are on the run the location data is not really that valuable. I could physically stalk you after all without buying the data from telecom companies. With Facebook the advertising can be quite precise. I remeber I read somewhere that you could actually target specific persons.

Re: Google Demanded T-Mobile, Sprint Not Sell Google Fi Customers' Location Data

#160

Post by vkou »

taneq wrote: post #156
vkou wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With ratings, on a scale of one to ten, how would you compare the individual harm of someone showing you a demographic-targeted ad[1], to someone having the real-time location data sufficient to start physically stalking you? What about someone showing you an untargeted ad? Where would that fit in? [1] Or, if you prefer, a remarketing ad, instead. I have very little patience for those.

The harm to me isn't the harm of someone showing me a demographic-targeted ad, the harm is someone showing everyone demographic-targeted ads designed to manipulate public opinion. Remember how everyone got very hot and bothered about precisely this thing happening in a recent U.S. election?

Why are cookie-based demographic-targeting ads that manipulate public opinion bad, while demographic-targeting ads on television, in magazines, etc, are fine? Is it because more targeted ad spend is more efficient?

If your problem is that advertising is used to manipulate public opinion - consider - why do we even allow political campaigns and paid speech? Its only purpose is to manipulate public opinion, and to trick stupid voters into voting for bad people.

I'm afraid your position is not entirely ideologically consistent with how we determine what kind of political speech is allowed, and is not allowed.

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