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Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

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Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#71

Post by master-litty »

idontgetit12 wrote: post #63
ChrisSD wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you purposely being dense? Your response has merit but it would be better if you assumed good faith. Even if you don't understand their thinking.

You're right, it shouldn't be necessary, but their first sentence... >I was convinced for a while there as I scrolled down that this was a joke. "Good parody!" I thought to myself. Then I realized to my horror this is actually serious. ...is pompous and holier than thou. Being unable to see the value in this infographic doesn't mean it's trash, and I think it's unnecessary to comment with such an arrogant attitude li…

>pompous and holier than thou

That's not a good faith interpretation.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#72

Post by jermaustin1 »

sosborn wrote: post #49
mscasts wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have, but I have always used normal html+css?

That works for simple emails, but when you start creating more complex designs tables are an essential tool to ensuring that every element behaves as you would expect: https://templates.mailchimp.com/getting-started/html-email-b... Building these types of emails without tables is doable, but you are going to get a lot of inconsistency depending on the device/client/browser.

I had worked on a project in 2010. It was a service that let you pick email stationary, customize it, and had a Outlook add-in and a bookmarklet.

It "worked" in Outlook (2003, 2007, 2010), Yahoo, Hotmail, and Gmail. And had to display correctly to the recipient in each of those clients.

It was by far the biggest pain in the ass I've ever worked on. Tables weren't enough to make it work outright. Outlook 2007+ couldn't do background images on a table cell, gmail would collapse empty cells, hotmail would remove certain inline styles, and yahoo was actually pretty nice.

The company I worked for took the project on for an equity split + payment plan, we saw a few hundred dollars from it before they went out of business.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#73

Post by clairity »

pgm8705 wrote: post #22

This feels overwelming. While I realize Rails isn't the cool thing in the web space anymore, I'm still convinced the best way to get someone into web development is to sit them down with Michael Hartl's Ruby on Rails tutorial and have them go through it any number of times. I've turned several zero-experience friends and/or interns into career web developers this way.

agreed. i find it odd that node and php are called out as the easy way to get into backend. ruby seems more intuitive and friendly than either javascript or php (not so much that they're hard, but they have more non-intuitive quirks and weirdnesses).

i like rails a lot, but i can somewhat sympathize with the view that the magic underlying it might hinder learning for a beginner. but having learned other languages/frameworks first, rails seemed much cleaner (and welcome) in comparison.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#74

Post by driverdan »

sudofail wrote: post #12

I'm currently teaching my brother web development and I guarantee if I were to show him this, he'd just quit. This is way too much information. All a beginner needs to know is JS and the basics of HTML/CSS/SQL. If they have a mentor, the mentor should draw out and explain how frontend, backend and databases relate, and the general lifecycle of a request to a webpage. That's all you really need to start building stuff…

> All a beginner needs to know is JS and the basics of HTML/CSS/SQL.

If they're going to dabble on their own stuff for fun sure, that's all you need. If you're trying to get a job that won't cut it.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#76

Post by johnmarcus »

jaredcwhite wrote: post #34

I was convinced for a while there as I scrolled down that this was a joke. "Good parody!" I thought to myself. Then I realized to my horror this is actually serious. As a web developer since 1997, currently working in both the Rails & JAMstack spaces, I can assure any and all beginners out there you don't need to know anything about at least 50% of this stuff, probably closer to 70%. I also deeply resent the notion t…

You don’t have to chose a path, but if you do chose a path these are the tools you would need to learn to call yourself competent in that discipline/area of work - because these roles definitely exist once your no longer a dev team of 3 or less.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#77

Post by johnmarcus »

peckrob wrote: post #57
jaredcwhite wrote: post #34

I was convinced for a while there as I scrolled down that this was a joke. "Good parody!" I thought to myself. Then I realized to my horror this is actually serious. As a web developer since 1997, currently working in both the Rails & JAMstack spaces, I can assure any and all beginners out there you don't need to know anything about at least 50% of this stuff, probably closer to 70%. I also deeply resent the notion t…

> I also deeply resent the notion that you have to "choose a path." Yup. Been doing this since 1999. The whole "front end"/"back end" thing is an incredibly unrealistic and unnecessary division. Real life work is much more complicated and nuanced than that. I don't know of anyone, maybe outside of (as you said) huge companies, who works that way, having "picked a path" and entirely focusing on one side of the stack.…

Bullshit. No way you are telling me backend folks want to spend their day writing front end css code and compiling modejs. Certainly, if and when you are ‘full stack’ you can and may do both.....but that implies both exist to begin with.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#78

Post by chx »

peckrob wrote: post #57
jaredcwhite wrote: post #34

I was convinced for a while there as I scrolled down that this was a joke. "Good parody!" I thought to myself. Then I realized to my horror this is actually serious. As a web developer since 1997, currently working in both the Rails & JAMstack spaces, I can assure any and all beginners out there you don't need to know anything about at least 50% of this stuff, probably closer to 70%. I also deeply resent the notion t…

> I also deeply resent the notion that you have to "choose a path." Yup. Been doing this since 1999. The whole "front end"/"back end" thing is an incredibly unrealistic and unnecessary division. Real life work is much more complicated and nuanced than that. I don't know of anyone, maybe outside of (as you said) huge companies, who works that way, having "picked a path" and entirely focusing on one side of the stack.…

> The whole "front end"/"back end" thing is an incredibly unrealistic and unnecessary division

Ever since server side javascript turned serious with node.js and "full stack developer" became a thing I have been stupefied by this. The concerns are almost orthogonal: front end gets some data which needs to be presented in a browser. Chief concerns are proper placement and appearance. Back end needs to persist data and retrieve data at speed. They absolutely have nothing to do with each other. How is this an "unnecessary division"?

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#79

Post by Domenic_S »

peckrob wrote: post #57
jaredcwhite wrote: post #34

I was convinced for a while there as I scrolled down that this was a joke. "Good parody!" I thought to myself. Then I realized to my horror this is actually serious. As a web developer since 1997, currently working in both the Rails & JAMstack spaces, I can assure any and all beginners out there you don't need to know anything about at least 50% of this stuff, probably closer to 70%. I also deeply resent the notion t…

> I also deeply resent the notion that you have to "choose a path." Yup. Been doing this since 1999. The whole "front end"/"back end" thing is an incredibly unrealistic and unnecessary division. Real life work is much more complicated and nuanced than that. I don't know of anyone, maybe outside of (as you said) huge companies, who works that way, having "picked a path" and entirely focusing on one side of the stack.…

Given the trajectory of front-end frameworks like React, I'm pretty sure front-end and back-end are going to be two very separate tracks about 5 years from now. Front end is just getting too complicated to be a complete expert in while also being an expert in writing microservices too.

Re: Roadmap to becoming a web developer in 2019

#80

Post by johnmarcus »

robgering wrote: post #58

These roadmaps are always hilarious to me. The real roadmap to becoming a web developer is "write code and convince someone to pay you." I suppose you could even leave the paying part off, if you are contributing to open source or writing code for yourself. Of course, you should do a great job, dedicate regular time to learning, and explore things that interest you. These maxims are probably true for success in many…

I guess that’s why it’s a path. As you walk it, you learn it.
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