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A Guide for Adults Going to College

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Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#71

Post by pooppaint »

two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

You are overgeneralizing. Also I quite enjoyed working with students about 14 years my junior, so that’s like just your opinion, man. (I also have a suspicion you’re much younger than me, which I find amusing).

> I don't think anyone needs a degree anymore to get to where they're going.

There are plenty of professions outside of tech where formalized education is held in the same regard as 100 years ago. The “times have changed” thing is very much a tech bubblethink. Good luck entering medicine or academia without a degree. There are outliers in these fields but that isn’t anything new.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#72

Post by [deleted] »

two2two wrote: post #70
whatshisface wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there should be 4 semesters a year, not 2, people should graduate in 2 years, not 4+ Could you provide some more details about the community college curriculum you are talking about? To my knowledge, the local community colleges offer what is essentially the first two years of a university education, with a reduced emphasis on your actual major. > each day forward is increasingly difficult to stomach since I realiz…

You're correct -- community college courses were "core" or "foundation" prior to the major. What I was attempting to suggest is 16-week semesters are too long (CC and Uni) and feel unnecessarily long for most subjects.

[deleted]

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#73

Post by dsajames »

two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

I don't know where you went to school, but I did some CC and completed a BS. It was the opposite for me. CC treated people like hs kids, at uni, I did all the research I could desire. Classes were way harder, the subject matter infinitely more in depth, etc.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#74

Post by whatshisface »

pooppaint wrote: post #71
two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

You are overgeneralizing. Also I quite enjoyed working with students about 14 years my junior, so that’s like just your opinion, man. (I also have a suspicion you’re much younger than me, which I find amusing). > I don't think anyone needs a degree anymore to get to where they're going. There are plenty of professions outside of tech where formalized education is held in the same regard as 100 years ago. The “times h…

>Good luck entering [...] academia without a degree.

Given that a PhD is basically a training course on how to be a professor, I think that one might actually be fair. The harshest criticism of PhDs is that they are only vocational training for professors, even.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#75

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

I've had the exact opposite experience - community college (as well as a technical institute - I've been around) was filled with high school class equivalents taught by professors who treated you all like children. When I got into university with classes in the hundreds was the minute that you needed to get to work cause no one cared.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#76

Post by gojomo »

jshowa3 wrote: post #29
gojomo wrote: post #23

I'm looking forward to someone writing "It's Always Too Early". It'd be a guide for people of all ages to acquire the same education/network/skills as college purportedly offers, without the immense monetary and opportunity costs of the legacy university system.

Problem is many companies work off this legacy system and won't hire you without a degree. No engineering degree, no law degree, no doctor degree, no degree at all? No thanks. Of course I'm not saying there are other ways, but its very naive to think that you can get anywhere without one. Not only that, the "legacy university system" is a system that's big on research and has invented things like the very Internet yo…

Sure, but many of the best companies are deemphasizing traditional credentials, commensurate with the bloating of the the university system and the rise of other training/evaluation methods.

With student debts and the rise of alternative tracks, we may be very close to a rapid tipping point, where the apparent safety of the traditional credentials – with stodgier institutions – collapses quickly.

And, the university system of 2019 isn't quite the same thing as the university system that gave us "the very Internet… used to type this comment" and other advances. It's a several-generations-removed descendant, with much higher costs, larger bureaucracy, more bundled tangential "lifestyle" services, heavier political loads, and so forth.

That some legacy university research has historically generated societal dividends isn't necessarily relevant to a prospective undergrad in 2019. That's especially so for those struggling with the kinds of questions addressed by the 'Never Too Late' book, like "What do I do if it's been ages since I took algebra?" They need efficient instruction. The fact that groundbreaking grant-funded research by graduate students might be happening in a nearby building is about as relevant as their school's football ranking in the Top-25 polls.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#77

Post by dx87 »

dsajames wrote: post #73
two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

I don't know where you went to school, but I did some CC and completed a BS. It was the opposite for me. CC treated people like hs kids, at uni, I did all the research I could desire. Classes were way harder, the subject matter infinitely more in depth, etc.

My wife had the same experience teaching at a CC. The school accepted anybody who applied, and they pressured professors to pass everyone regardless of their grades because they just wanted the tuition money. She stopped teaching there after 1 semester because she said it felt like being a babysitter and salesperson instead of a teacher.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#78

Post by sjg007 »

xyzzyz wrote: post #33
sjg007 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will happen if you vote blue. The first wave of it was 10 year of payments and then debt forgiveness.

That will push college prices even higher.

There are plenty of mechanisms to counter this. One is direct funding of colleges as we did before via state and Federal funding. Another is to establish a feedback loop where loan guarantees and funding for the institution are a function of their students default rate: that way if the education doesn't lead to jobs then the school gets less money.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#79

Post by xyzzyz »

two2two wrote: post #63

I'm a returning student about to complete my degree at the end of this year. I went to an art school for a few years out of high school and ended up in customer service positions with some great companies. I didn't want to continue in customer service, so I decided to go back to school. Started with two years at community college, and now finishing up my last two at university. Some insights I picked up along the way…

- there should be 4 semesters a year, not 2, people should graduate in 2 years, not 4+

At the onset of this journey, I was enthusiastic to learn, but along the way I've been beat down to just wanting to get "the piece of paper" and be done. It's been a long three years and each day forward is increasingly difficult to stomach since I realized I can learn all of what is being taught to me faster on my own.

The fact that it’s a 4-year slog is one of the factors that make university degree holders earn premium in the labor marketplace — conscientiousness, conformity and consistency required to slog through 4 years needed for school to certify it send employers a strong signal that you’re the kind of person who will do their job well. Thus, don’t give up, the paper certifying it is more important than the “education” you are getting.

Re: A Guide for Adults Going to College

#80

Post by athenot »

twoquestions wrote: post #19
chrisseaton wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't see a business owner tolerating someone with age but not experience But why would they care if two people have the same experience but one is older? What difference does it make that they wouldn't tolerate?

From what I've read here on HN (and other places), even with experience, ageist bigotry is a significant impact on people's careers, I can only imagine it's worse sans experience.

On the bright side, those are probably the companies you don't want to work for. It is one of the signals for bad company culture.
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