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The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

nytimes.com

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Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#81

Post by darkerside »

kingraoul3 wrote: post #54

“Intensive parenting is a way for especially affluent white mothers to make sure their children are maintaining their advantaged position in society,” said Jessica Calarco, a sociologist at Indiana University and author of “Negotiating Opportunities: How the Middle Class Secures Advantages in School.” I guess especially affluent mother of color don't do this? NYT conflating race and class to divide people again.

Yeah, that's upsetting. If I were paranoid, I'd consider whether it were intentional brainwashing designed to perpetuate the superiority of the white race. Of course, I'm not paranoid, so I don't think it's intentional at all.

But, I do think it may have that unintended effect.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#82

Post by sdinsn »

toasterlovin wrote: post #72
Animats wrote: post #52

Key quote: "As the gap between rich and poor increases, the cost of screwing up increases. The fear is they’ll end up on the other side of the divide." In 1970, failure was a job on the assembly line at Ford in Detroit. Until 1974, the auto companies didn't require a high school diploma. Union job, good pay. Now it's homelessness and drug addiction.

So there were no homeless or drug addicts before the 90s?

There were significantly less before the 80s.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#83

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg »

gumby wrote: post #29
AlwaysRock wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I wish my parents would have been a little more hands on with a lot of this type of stuff.

My kid used to say that until he got to college and realised that his classmates were comparatively less able to figure things out.

Solid anecdata. My parents were fairly hands on, and I had a way easier time in college than most of my classmates.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#84

Post by bootsz »

gdubs wrote: post #13

Ironically we end up creating a ton of anxiety for kids. And unless we’re giving kids the love and tools needed to process that anxiety, well, then we’re missing the forest for the trees. I have three kids under five years old, and man it goes fast. My philosophy has evolved to this: they’re their own people, not extensions of our own ego, and in the limited time we have influence over them we can help them develop c…

> they’re their own people, not extensions of our own ego

So true. I feel like a large portion of all the conflict that arises between parents and children stems from a failure to understand this.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#85

Post by onemorethrowa »

onemorethrowa wrote: post #73
ideonexus wrote: post #5

I didn't realize it until I read this article, but this is what keeps me up at night and motivates me to spend so much time and effort on my children. Making sure my kids are successful adults and maintain the economic lifestyle my programming career currently affords them is why I send them to camps all summer long and martial arts classes in the afternoons to improve their focus. It's why my wife and I spent hours…

I guess people are different, and my own experiences are by no means generally applicable, but if you had been my parent, I'm convinced that you had me done a massive disservice. I consider myself to be relatively successful, financially and otherwise. For example, I make significantly north of what you would consider a good salary even in the silicon valley (I do want to retire early), doing an interesting job that…

Oh, and just to drive the point home: My wife had a closer experience to what you describe, and "catching up" for a childhood and adolescence that she feels she never had is a significant part of our shared life (and it's a pretty big topic when it comes to parenting for her as well).

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#86

Post by frereubu »

gnarbarian wrote: post #19
ideonexus wrote: post #5

I didn't realize it until I read this article, but this is what keeps me up at night and motivates me to spend so much time and effort on my children. Making sure my kids are successful adults and maintain the economic lifestyle my programming career currently affords them is why I send them to camps all summer long and martial arts classes in the afternoons to improve their focus. It's why my wife and I spent hours…

Counterpoint: There's definitely an argument for letting kids figure some things out on their own. Giving them autonomy helps them mature faster in a number of ways. If your life is micro managed down to the minute you won't learn the self discipline to do things without an authority figure looming over you. Learning to solve disputes amicably between each other without requiring an authority figure is very important…

> I've seen many young adults completely melt down and go off the rails when they leave their home and go to college because they never learned real self discipline.

Absolutely. And it's not a new thing, just different reasons. My dad, who was born in the 1920s, came from a puritan Christian background (Plymouth Brethren). We asked a few friends of his to speak at his funeral, and one talked about how, when he got to university, he discovered he enjoyed alcoholic drinks. However, because control had always come from outside - The Church - he had no internal limits and would regularly drink until he passed out. Even in his later life my mum would need to tug his sleeve during parties when he was starting to go from merry to drunk.

Having said that, it's very difficult to get the sweet spot between giving kids leeway and leaving them open to turning feral. A colleague's kid recently got drawn into a gang and was arrested for credit card fraud despite attentive parenting.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#87

Post by xamuel »

GreeniFi wrote: post #58
gdubs wrote: post #13

Ironically we end up creating a ton of anxiety for kids. And unless we’re giving kids the love and tools needed to process that anxiety, well, then we’re missing the forest for the trees. I have three kids under five years old, and man it goes fast. My philosophy has evolved to this: they’re their own people, not extensions of our own ego, and in the limited time we have influence over them we can help them develop c…

How do you do this?

Not the person you replied to, but re: forming good habits: I make a point that instead of saying e.g. "Wow, you're so good at drawing" to my kids, instead I say e.g. "Wow, you're getting so good at drawing because you keep practicing so much! It feels so good to practice and improve!" Works great so far :)

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#88

Post by frereubu »

perfmode wrote: post #31
AlwaysRock wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I wish my parents would have been a little more hands on with a lot of this type of stuff.

Every child is doomed to repeat the mistake of doing the opposite of the mistake they perceive their parents made with them.

Or, as Philip Larkin jokingly had it:

They f__k you up, your mum and dad / They may not mean to, but they do / They fill you with the faults they had / And add some extra, just for you.

But they were f__ked up in their turn / By fools in old-style hats and coats, / Who half the time were soppy-stern / And half at one another’s throats.

Man hands on misery to man. / It deepens like a coastal shelf. / Get out as early as you can, / And don’t have any kids yourself.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#89

Post by pastor_elm »

ideonexus wrote: post #5

I didn't realize it until I read this article, but this is what keeps me up at night and motivates me to spend so much time and effort on my children. Making sure my kids are successful adults and maintain the economic lifestyle my programming career currently affords them is why I send them to camps all summer long and martial arts classes in the afternoons to improve their focus. It's why my wife and I spent hours…

a gifted program only prepares them for being coddled.

Re: The Relentlessness of Modern Parenting

#90

Post by InclinedPlane »

It's easy to forget that the purpose of parenting and raising children isn't to baby sit them for 18 years, cram them full of "information" and then turn them loose on the world. The purpose is to incrementally transform them from children into adults-in-training into full adults. That necessitates allowing minors responsibility, agency, and autonomy prior to becoming adults, otherwise they will have no experience (and no mastery) of those things when they become adults. And that necessitates risk, because without risk there is no true responsibility, agency, or autonomy. Kids are going to make mistakes, but it's important that they be their mistakes, otherwise they can't learn, they can't have ownership of their lives, they can't grow in their sense of self and in their emotional maturity, they can't acquire resiliency, etc.
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