The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet? • Hacker News Board

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#21

Post by b_tterc_p » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:38 PM UTC

The authors assertion that swearing isn’t bad annoys me. Swearing isn’t bad, but that’s not the point. Not swearing in certain contexts is obviously just a social norm, not a rational evaluation. It’s ok and natural for social norms to change.

I would wager The overall thesis seems to be that non rationally proven social norms are negative influences is naive to the fact that (I would guess) strong social norms of any variety in a society lead to better community and happiness.

I feel that by arguing we change a bunch of established norms because we can be smarter than them, he’s unintentionally tripling down on the very effects he’s advocating against.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#22

Post by everdev » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:40 PM UTC

vorpalhex wrote: post #3

There is nothing which will make you happy. You must choose to be happy. There is no job, no amount of money, no relationship, which will make you feel whole and happy and content and done. The opposite doesn't hold - there are jobs and relationships and financial strains which will certainly keep you from being happy. The goal isn't for a job or a relationship to make you happy. It's to enable other things which are…

Happiness is an emotion, it comes and goes. Even the premise of "are you happy?" is missing the point.

Are we talking about feeling happiness twice as much as feeling sadness? 4x, 10x? Sadness can come from things outside our control.

I think a better goal is are you present? Are you listening to yourself and to what you really want for your life?

Everyone will want different things but making an emotion the goal is a fools errand.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#23

Post by thegabez » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:41 PM UTC

Karawebnetwork wrote: post #12

Money gave me stability. Stability allowed me to have time for introspection. Introspection allowed me to target issues in my life. Fixing those issues is lowering my discomfort in life. Money won't fix anything for you but it will provide you an environment where you can.

Agreed. The need for introspection will happen many times over in the course of a lifetime. Saving in anticipation for these transitional periods should be a top priority.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#24

Post by whitepoplar » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:41 PM UTC

"Money might not buy happiness, but I'll take my fucking chances."

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#25

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:42 PM UTC

AznHisoka wrote: post #19

dx87 wrote: post #4

Overall I agree with the article, and would gladly trade my high paying job for one that I actually enjoy, as long as I could be sure that I can make ends meet. The one disagreement I have is the assertion that we should be happy making "just enough" money that we need. "just enough" can change due to circumstances outside our control, so earning more than enough gives you some cushion for when things don't go as pla…

I totally agree, and while a good % of HN readers probably are making a lot, the vast majority of people (at least in the US) are living month to month.

I went mattress shopping yesterday. The fact that there's options for financing a $2000 purchase is indicative that "just enough" is, in fact, not.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#26

Post by PakG1 » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:43 PM UTC

vorpalhex wrote: post #3

There is nothing which will make you happy. You must choose to be happy. There is no job, no amount of money, no relationship, which will make you feel whole and happy and content and done. The opposite doesn't hold - there are jobs and relationships and financial strains which will certainly keep you from being happy. The goal isn't for a job or a relationship to make you happy. It's to enable other things which are…

Very true, but once you make the decision, all those other things are multipliers. Just unfortunately, if you make the negative decision, well the negative still multiplies too.... hence the divorces and all the drama at work....

If you took away my marriage and job, I would be markedly more unhappy. I imagine if I ever have a big wad of cash sitting around, I would be a bit less happy if that disappeared too (only because keeping it around certainly would only keep me at the status quo, if not make me more happy).

What's that they say about coming into a lot of money, that it just reveals who your true self is?

And yes, some people get into crappy marriages or crappy jobs where they just get knocked down 24/7. But I've observed that negative people easily self-prophesy into negative situations far more often than positive people.

edit: added points

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#27

Post by howard941 » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:46 PM UTC

Why the great disparity in job satisfaction between UK and US lawyers? 64% of UK lawyers are satisfied compared to (unequal measures, yeah) Associate Attorneys who were at a 2.89 "Bliss Score" the unhappiest profession (https://www.forbes.com/pictures/efkk45ehffl/no-1-unhappiest-...)

As for myself I am generally unhappy. I left the law and back to engineering which I love, I'm married but spend too little time with my wife because we're in different cities and live apart most of the time, I'm sad most of the time when I'm not working, I don't have any life battering chronic diseases, I take home enough money that I'm not indebted other than for my house and FFS am I grateful for that. So no, I'm not happy, but I've stopped expecting happiness so there is some satisfaction in not experiencing repeated disappointment.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#28

Post by kazagistar » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:47 PM UTC

Loughla wrote: post #10

Like literally everything else, it's about balance. No, you shouldn't let the world dictate your choices every single day. But also you need to conform to some amount of societal standard. Social norms exist sometimes to keep society working and moving forward. As for happiness, if you are trying to 'get' happiness through external forces, you're never going to be happy. That's not a secret.

And sometimes the social norm's arent helpful. In the article, he makes it clear he rejects each norm mentioned specifically because he has reflected on it and found it non helpful, and at least slightly harmful (if only to individual autonomy and happyness). Saying norm's can help is a platitude, but when considered individually you might find most are only actually more beneficial then harmful very situationally.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#29

Post by vinceguidry » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:48 PM UTC

kemayo wrote: post #15

vinceguidry wrote: post #7

Americans are becoming too rational and this is a major problem. When you over-value rationality, you expect to be able to have a rational answer to every question. The hand-licking story that made the front page today illustrates this point perfectly. Approached rationally, the mom could not solve the problem, no amount of mental effort would yield a resolution or insight into the issue. When the mind expects an ans…

> The hand-licking story that made the front page today illustrates this point perfectly. [...] > It is only when she applied an irrational approach to the problem, surrendering the need to control the situation, that she could finally understand what was going on. I feel like you have a somewhat idiosyncratic definition of "irrational" that you're applying here. What I took from the hand-licking story was that her i…

I think it's common for people, especially the overly-rational, to conflate correctness with rationality. Yes, with hindsight it can be seen that the actions she initially took were incorrect. But they seemed perfectly rational approaches at the time.

If you see your child doing something anti-social, then it's logical to try to correct it because if you don't, it will cause problems for them down the road. In fact, it would have been irrational to not do anything about it.

It was only when the logical brain got overridden by maternal instinct that she could choose an approach that led eventually to a resolution.

The logical brain demands control over the situation. If she could have surrendered control earlier, perhaps even in the first few times she witnessed it, then she could have taken a less-combative approach.

Re: The money, job, marriage myth: are you happy yet?

#30

Post by djohnston » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

“Marry, and you will regret it; don’t marry, you will also regret it; marry or don’t marry, you will regret it either way. Laugh at the world’s foolishness, you will regret it; weep over it, you will regret that too; laugh at the world’s foolishness or weep over it, you will regret both. Believe a woman, you will regret it; believe her not, you will also regret it… Hang yourself, you will regret it; do not hang yourself, and you will regret that too; hang yourself or don’t hang yourself, you’ll regret it either way; whether you hang yourself or do not hang yourself, you will regret both. This, gentlemen, is the essence of all philosophy.” ― Søren Kierkegaard