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Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

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Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#71

Post by echotangowhisky »

ForHackernews wrote: post #42

Does anyone else find it strange that threads on Mozilla articles submitted to HN are filled with privacy-absolutists while articles about Google/Chromium are disproportionately commented on by Google apologists? Are there two radically divergent subsets of HN users who hardly comment on articles about the other major browser?

I think the difference is how they position themselves. Mozilla claims to fight for you and keep your data safe, Google claims to be an advertising company.

It would be like if McDonald's sold an "all beef burger" that contained no actual beef, or if the Impossible Burger was found to contain any beef at all.

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#72

Post by peterwwillis »

zzzcpan wrote: post #69
peterwwillis wrote: post #56

Mozilla bragging to me about how they're defending me on the web is like Smith & Wesson telling me they're keeping me safe from guns. It also seems like the height of hypocrisy to complain about data privacy when people use almost exclusively free services online. Somebody has to pay for it all, and since users refuse to do so, advertising has to. It's simple math: if you don't pay for content, your data will be mone…

Invasive advertisement doesn't fund most of the web, it only funds some thousands of top websites and I bet most of them can exist without invasive tracking and banners. There are still brand deals and content advertising and other forms of non banner advertisement, not to mention non advertising business models. And most websites can't exist on advertising revenue anyway and are funded some other way.

There's no question of whether a business can exist without targeted advertising ("invasive" advertising). But they're definitely going to use it whenever feasible, because it's the most efficient form, possibly more than direct marketing.

The ways a business can make money online are A) partnerships, B) advertising, C) goods/services, D) subscriptions, or E) community. The last two are dwarfed by the first three, which depend on advertising. Even if you're a B2B, you still need marketing to get new clients, which almost invariably includes some kind of advertising.

So the majority of websites people visit are still paid for with some form of marketing. It may be indirect, such as by affiliate, partnership, selling of private data, etc, or it may be direct, such as with advertisements and spam/newsletters. The user is still going to pay for it, one way or another. If they're not paying via a subscription or donation, they're paying through their use as a marketing target. (And often, via both!)

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#73

Post by fxfan »

doe88 wrote: post #38
fxfan wrote: post #2

Lets start with removing pocket and installing unlock origin by default. I'll believe you. And I say this as a loyal user since 2006.,

Don't like Pocket, don't use it. I personally find it convenient, I'm not at the point I consider everything I browse equally sensitive. There are pages I don't consider being particularly sensitive I want to read later without cluttering my tabs. I really understand peoples wanting to protect everything , it's a valid choice, but I'm not there yet personally, thus for me Pocket is useful.

I don't hate pocket. I like it! I just don't think it is in sync with their posturing.

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#74

Post by dcbadacd »

orcdork wrote: post #40
rcw4256 wrote: post #14

"You decide what to share and when." That's demonstrably false. Disabling telemetry resulted in the collection of meta-telemetry, in violation of users' explicitly expressed decision to not allow collection of telemetry. https://www.ghacks.net/2018/09/21/mozilla-wants-to-estimate-...

For 1% of the users opting out of telemetry. And anonymized. And also the data not being telemetry related. Technicaly correct, but pretending that this is mozilla going against the spirit of "decide what to share and when" is at best stretching it, and worst case willingly misrepresenting the case.

It literally went against the spirit of "decide what to share and when" if I check "never" and it does.

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#75

Post by craftyguy »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #28
craftyguy wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everything can be disabled. If it is enabled by default, then they are doing it wrong.

That's just your opinion. I do not mind sharing data with them by default because I know the data helps their long-term survival. Especially because I know I'm lazy (like most people are) so if it's opt-in I wouldn't bother turning things on.

> I do not mind sharing data

That's just your opinion. Mozilla should be very clear, up front, about what data they collect by default[1], so that users can make educated decisions about whether to allow it. This whole "we promise to protect everything (lol) we collect about you" PR stunt obscures the fact that they are collecting data from users by default.

1. They 'detail' it in the privacy policy, but 1) almost all end users will not see a link to it and 2) almost all end users will not consider that Mozilla is collecting data from them by default.

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#76

Post by dcbadacd »

skyfaller wrote: post #32
vnw wrote: post #23

Your decision to show ads to your users this last week without their consent was the last straw for me. And believe me, I've stood A LOT from you. My relationship with you has been practically abusive. Farewell Mozilla, it's been real.

Where on earth are you going? Chrome? There are no other independent browser engines left besides Firefox, web browsers are a duopoly now and if you think Google is better on data collection and ads than Mozilla, I have a bridge to sell you.

The very least I'm well aware of what it does and it's not hiding it and it doesn't eat my laptop's battery with anything WebGL or video-related (and also does both without any glitches).

Re: Firefox Fights for You. We keep your data safe, never sold

#77

Post by TheRealPomax »

lucideer wrote: post #60
ubercow13 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your browser history _is_ a personal profile of your browsing preferences. What's the difference?

Nobody said it wasn't? What's your point? The only thing that's being debated is whether sending a personal profile of your browsing preferences compiled from metadata is ok simply because it's not a personal profile of your browsing preferences consisting of your entire browsing history. You're right that both things are profiles—that's not being argued.

Except that metadata isn't getting sent to pocket. Firefox gets the full list of pocket recommendations, and it, locally, picks which to show you, based on your browsing history. The entire thing you object so strongly to, namely things getting sent to mozilla _never happens_ and neither mozilla, nor pocket --nor anyone else except people who hack into your computer or your firefox account if you use such a thing-- will ever know what you're in to, if you turn of the general data sharing that you probably already have turned off for firefox because you're privacy-conscious.
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