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Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

atrium.co

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Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#161

Post by sjroot »

palidanx wrote: post #43
mcny wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are an Apple engineer and can help get that shipped, I will buy you a nice dinner. If you're an Apple recruiter, hire me so I can help ship it! :) Not that I know anything not known publicly but I suspect the reason Apple iOS Safari does not have Web Push API is not because they lack developer resources to write the code to get it done. Apple is under tremendous pressure to increase revenue from its "service…

Wouldn't you say though if that push notifications were allowed PWAs would cannibalize the revenue of the ios app store? It doesn't seem like apple would have much incentive to do this as PWAs would eventually compete with their own platform.

You can integrate Apple Pay pretty seamlessly into a PWA. It actually adds a lot in the way of feeling like a real native app.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#163

Post by trophycase »

ecp9 wrote: post #137

I don't even bother installing apps anymore, I don't have time to research whether or not they are going to abuse my privacy or have some horrendous TOS. I got my core 10 apps and haven't bought a new one in a year.

I figure most things don't need an app unless they are trying to take more data anyway. Anything telling me to install an app whose mobile experience is fine already is very fishy to me. I'm looking at you, Reddit.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#164

Post by EmielMols »

fermuch wrote: post #153
NightlyDev wrote: post #150

Most of my mobile users(64 %) has the page added to the home screen, and it's awesome. There is however one problem in all things web: Apple. The amount of bugs in Safari on iOS is incredible and the developers should be ashamed of their work. Safari is literally worse than IE6 was. But sure, users can just switch to Chrome.. Oh, wait, we're talking iOS here, so there is only one engine, and that engine is broken. So…

Is there a way to know when a site is loaded from the home screen instead of the browser?

Yes, window.navigator.standalone

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#165

Post by wvenable »

johnday wrote: post #135
wvenable wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens if something catastrophic occurs?

What do you mean by catastrophic? It's safe from the obvious things: * DB corruption / destruction: The database is backed up. * FS corruption / destruction: The production code is backed up with version control (obviously) and can be restored at the drop of a hat. * The server just randomly falls off the internet: It would take about 2 hours to get a new server up to the same point. What kind of problems could arise…

How frequently is that database backed up? How many hours of work are users going to lose? And you're going to wake up at 3:00am and take 2 hours to get a new server online?

This is all fine for a service with a few thousand users that's not mission critical. But I assume the article is about building apps to be a real business not just a hobby.

I run a few hobby sites under the same scenario as you but all my work sites have multiple servers to fail over to and replicated databases.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#166

Post by [deleted] »

NightlyDev wrote: post #150

Most of my mobile users(64 %) has the page added to the home screen, and it's awesome. There is however one problem in all things web: Apple. The amount of bugs in Safari on iOS is incredible and the developers should be ashamed of their work. Safari is literally worse than IE6 was. But sure, users can just switch to Chrome.. Oh, wait, we're talking iOS here, so there is only one engine, and that engine is broken. So…

[deleted]

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#167

Post by phs2501 »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #149
phs2501 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Indeed, right now we're seeing a big uptick in Instant Apps on Android -- go to a webpage and it actually loads a native app -- and I fully expect the same to appear on iOS. I'd never heard of this but I can guarantee I will immediately quit and never install an app that gets forced upon me via this method. This is like the terrible "Try our app!" web popups, only 10x worse. I realize like most people on HN I'm har…

I saw it for the first time last night. I think it was Vimeo. It was actually much better than the "try our app" popup, because it was android asking if i wanted to use the instant app, and when i said no it just went away.

That's more reasonable. I wonder if these work via Firefox? Maybe that's why I've never seen them.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#168

Post by endorphone »

mbesto wrote: post #75
endorphone wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've been hearing the same pitch for literally years. Heck, I've made some of them myself: "This is it, people! Native apps have been rendered unnecessary!" No PWA competes with a native experience. Not performance wise, not usability wise, and ultimately for the developer not even development wise. It may still make a lot of sense, and there are a lot of arguments for web apps, but the enthusiasm in this discussion…

> but the enthusiasm in this discussion seems disconnected from reality. This isn't the OP's point. The point is there is more friction to download new apps today so coming out with a new native experience is going to much harder to do in today's world. It doesn't mean that this is the long term strategy.

I'm speaking to this discussion, not the submitted article. Sure, start with a web app (though it really depends on the target -- if the web app yields a sub-standard interface, performance, or utility it's a dead end) with hopes of building an app when you have an established base.

However in this discussion there are a lot of people who are arguing from the perspective of a world that doesn't exist, based upon the same "this changes everything" argument we've heard every year.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#169

Post by wvenable »

casper345 wrote: post #111

80% of apps are uninstalled in the first 10min (especially if they ask for information or creating an account). Once uninstalled very unlikely they will ever install again. In my dev shop, I always advise clients to look into website MVP over apps unless IT IS CRITICAL to the functionality. Websites can always bring back ppl who were initially uninterested. Faster development/instant updates. Better tracking and UX a…

How many websites ever get passed the signup stage? I often will leave as soon as I'm tasked with creating an account and I'm not likely to come back.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#170

Post by wvenable »

shams93 wrote: post #2

Given the fact that most people are already maxed out on apps on their device with just things like facebook and youtube, you're going to be hard pressed to get people to install your app just to try it out. With a progressive web app if they like your app they can add it to their device home screen without installing via the app store and without using up space on their device. Also don't need to pay Apple $100 a ye…

> Given the fact that most people are already maxed out on apps on their device

This argument has been given a few times here. But I question whether web applications are a solution. Aren't these just more applications that people are overwhelmed with but harder to find and use?

If you've got a brilliant new app (web or mobile) I'm still fatigued either way. The mental effort is the same. Saying the mobile apps are "maxed out" seems to me to apply to web apps in just the same way.

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