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Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

andrewbrookins.com

61–70 of 196 posts

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#61
Programming is not just about programming tools, it is about the OS environment.

I prefer being able to arrange things anywhere, and the iPad has always bugged me by rationing shared-app screen space as if I’m a child (you get up to this fraction of the screen but it must be arranged only “here”; or, you can picture-in-picture but only the specified way; etc.). My first iPad was wonderful for web browsing until web sites started doing exactly the same rationing, “locking in” some arrangement that they deemed appropriate, to hell with my preferences. Even the iOS launch screen is irritating, with icons wastefully arranged in a specific way that looks like no desktop I have ever had; and the Files app is not much more useful for navigating. The OS is about 5 years overdue for a “put stuff wherever the hell I want” capability.

And unfortunately, basic editing is also nowhere near where it needs to be on iOS. No matter how many hacks they add, cursor movement is still simply bad: it is way too hard to do the kind of precise changes I need to do. Pop-up menus are overloaded. The keyboard layout is asinine: unlike a physical keyboard, there is no room between the Delete and Return keys so I am constantly committing things early that I am still editing. (In cloud-sync apps like Notes, I occasionally permanently destroy text because I accidentally do something that is then screwed up on all other devices instantaneously for my convenience. When entering something like a URL, I regularly start “loading” an incompletely-typed address accidentally because the keyboard thinks I said Go.)

Therefore, there is no way I would use a tablet until they essentially recreate proper window, file and cursor management with full arbitrary resize and effortless dragging and plenty of keyboard short-cuts. This feels like a consequence of Apple perhaps splitting up the iOS and Mac teams too much: the Mac did have quite a bit and it’s almost like they’re being told to consider none of it and just invent everything anew, no matter how long that takes.

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a very lightweight device with an excellent screen, impressive battery life, and the option for built-in LTE. But yeah, in terms of functional capability to connect to a server and type stuff, other devices would work as well. Also an excellent tablet when you’re doing non-coding stuff.

Yeah I get the upsides but if the debate is really around whether or not an iOS device can be used for real work I'm not sure this really makes the case. It's also massive overkill to use such a powerful device as a web terminal. I guess another way to state what I'm saying is that when the iPad first launched there was a lot of speculation about what new kinds of productivity apps would be enabled by a big, fast tou…

I suspect it mostly comes from the iPad being a great all around device and a desire to consolidate. Given the choice I’d rather give up my laptop than my iPad.

A powerful desktop if I need that performance is a lot cheaper to keep around than a powerful laptop (or both).

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#63

Programming is not just about programming tools, it is about the OS environment. I prefer being able to arrange things anywhere , and the iPad has always bugged me by rationing shared-app screen space as if I’m a child (you get up to this fraction of the screen but it must be arranged only “here” ; or, you can picture-in-picture but only the specified way; etc.). My first iPad was wonderful for web browsing until web…

I don’t have any trouble with cursor movement, but text selection is really awful a lot of the time

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#64
Why not use a Surface? It's built with a physical keyboard as a first class experience, and you're not limited in what you can run. The only limitation is the lack of a polished POSIX environment, but that will of course be missing on iOS too.

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#65
post #4

If I could code on an iPad Pro, I’d finally get rid of my MacBook Pro. I think that’s exactly why apple doesn’t allow this at all...

Can you explain the appeal? As a long time iPhone and iPad owner, I find iOS intolerable and it gets worse with every release. Coding on an iPad would be like trying to prepare a 5 course dinner on a kid's Fisher Price kitchen or building an intricate model with Duplo Lego bricks. Maybe possible, but a terrible experience. So what am I missing?

I am genuinely baffled by "iOS gets worse with every release." If you wanted to argue that iOS's approach to multi-pane displays, application switching, and file management, should be better than it is now, sure, absolutely. But when I consider the improvements in the past few years -- the dock, split view, drag and drop, file providers, Shortcuts -- I confess I'm not thinking, "Man, I long for all the power and utility we had in iOS 6 that's lost to us now."

I mean, yes, iOS is still by and large a terrible coding environment, there are a host of long-standing complaints I have with other things both large and small, and I don't doubt I could find a few weird little annoying regressions, but I absolutely wouldn't want to run an earlier version of iOS on my iPad.

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#66
post #22

I'm struggling to work out why anyone would want to do this. Leaving aside the other concerns, I personally find input via touchscreen pretty painful and can't imagine being able to program at any real speed. It's entirely possible I'm missing something though!

I have the attachable keyboard stand that sits comfortably on my knee when I'm on the train. I can type as fast on that as I can a laptop. Honestly with a half decent IDE/dev toolchain it would be a fantastic little lightweight setup for coding.

I imagine if you coupled that with a stand of some sort, it'd be pretty close to a netbook or something. Thank you so much for the insight!

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#67
post #26

I'm struggling to work out why anyone would want to do this. Leaving aside the other concerns, I personally find input via touchscreen pretty painful and can't imagine being able to program at any real speed. It's entirely possible I'm missing something though!

I’m able to get an absurd amount banged out with just my thumbs. I’ve taken comprehensive meeting notes this way. Possibly the reason to do it for coding would be the ability to code from anywhere for quite a while on battery/cell. Mosh does not take up much bandwidth or power. As an example, I worked on some professional projects over mosh on my iPhone to my home network from work. My job at the time made a lot of t…

This is fascinating - thank you so much for replying. I used to have input speed back when we had physical buttons on phones but with the advent of touch-screens, that has deteriorated for me. I hadn't considered how useful it would be to have when a small laptop isn't available. Another commenter mentioned working on a train; I can certainly see the use-case. Thanks for the insight!

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#68
post #18

The iPad Pro will become a viable "pro" device when they finally stop artificially holding it back by not allowing a full version of Safari. Edit: and of course mouse/trackpad support

What’s missing?

It is the iOS version of Safari instead of the desktop version. Sites often opt for showing the mobile version.

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#69
i develop typically 3 types of things, backend rest services, web apps, and mobile apps. for me to truly rid myself of my macbook pro, i would need the following, or equivalents:

1. the ability to start vm’s, preferably locally, i use these to run persistent services like redis, rabbitmq, databases, etc. i have this philosophy where my dev env needs to get as close as possible to the production env (at least from a software stack perspective) which means linux, yet it cant cost me as much as a production env. homebrew is great, but i try to stay away as much as possible because it’s a little different from my production env. accessing an ec2 instance or rds instance to access my postgres database is a bit overkill, i want things fast during development, ie local. sometimes i’m in places with no wifi or 4g coverage is spotty, this would be a nightmare.

2. i use visual code for all development, sometimes vi if i dont have a gui env, visual code is lightweight and pretty solid. i’m not 100% stuck on visual code, so if there’s some browser based derivative of it or wsywig for coding then i’m good. visual code is written in electron so nodejs, so i dont think it’s impossible. web development, html, js, css, this can all be done on an ipad relatively well, all the browsers i need to support are available. there’s typically no compilation that needs to happen, unless you’re using nodejs modules on your frontend. i seem to remember some company providing a cloud service that allows you to develop remotely, i think they were bought by github/msft or someone. kind of an interesting area.

3. backend dev, typically i use golang, this becomes a bigger problem, surely i could ssh somewhere and compile, or use some x11/vnc-like tool since i prefer a graphical ide, but that defeats the purpose of my 1000 usd ipad. it’s not really a dumb terminal or thin client per se, i have enough compute power, i want to leverage it. plus i’d need to be spending all this money on ec2 like instances.

4. xcode, this is another major issue, i’m stuck on xcode, sure i could use xamarin, but i dont think that runs on ios yet either. if this were resolved, i could strongly consider scraping my macbook pro.

sounds kind of interesting if there could be a monthly service that could be purchased that provides you with remote dev envs without all the fuss of installing, managing any of it. e.g. i write code in a browser ide, it gets compiled in the cloud somewhere, deployed, and i can access it. i can connect different services to it, and testing is fully automated. i think i’d consider paying for something like this, but it’d have to be relatively cheap because otherwise i might as well do everything myself locally. i’m thinking 5 usd a month max.

i havent used chromebook, but i think it’s closer to a dev env than ipad pro at the moment, i think you can even start containers and such on it.

Re: Coding on an iPad Pro in 2019

#70
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hammers, nails, and screws a pretty much set. They're not changing regularly. An iPad becoming a laptop-replacement is happening - its progress is debatable, but it's definitely changing on each iteration.

If anything it feels like it's becoming clear that iOS is not going to be a viable OSX replacement for most professional use cases without a huge bump up in complexity. At which point you have to wonder why bother with it at all? Microsoft seems to have a much clearer vision here and anecdotally I know quite a few people that have been Mac users for ages that have given up on iPads and bought Surface devices because…

I think it's very easy to take a narrow view of "professional" here. iOS may never be a viable macOS replacement for programmers (although I don't think I'd place money on that), but there are professionals out there right now editing podcasts with Ferrite, editing videos with LumaFusion, doing multitrack music sequencing with Beat Maker, editing photos with Lightroom (and a host of other apps), writing Hollywood screenplays with Slugline or novels with Scrivener -- and doing a lot of more "mundane" work that is nonetheless absolutely professional level with Microsoft Office, Keynote, OmniGraffle, and others.

What an iPad will absolutely never do is mimic an existing workflow. People who try to do that are going to hit brick walls fast. I wouldn't be surprised to see full-fledged programming environments on iOS in the next few years (and to see iOS itself open up in possibly surprising ways), but I suspect they aren't going to look much like the programming environments we're used to.

I'm glad people love their Surfaces. They look like great devices. And, yeah, I wish I could do web development more easily on my iPad. But I'm a technical writer and a fiction writer, do both professionally, and have used the iPad to do (gasp) real work in both fields.

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