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Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

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Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#91
post #41

> To make their intentions clear, Ethereum’s core developers reprogrammed their PoW code to create an exponential rise in mining difficulty. Known as the “Difficulty Bomb,” it began slowing the creation of new transaction blocks in late 2016 and was expected to bring ether mining to a grinding halt a few years thereafter. > This time bomb has, however, functioned more like an alarm clock with a snooze button. In Octo…

[deleted]

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#92
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethereum claims to be the "World Computer" that lets you build "Unstoppable Applications". If that doesn't sound like an AWS competitor then I don't know.

Sure, it's in some sense "an AWS competitor" but something like a billion times less efficient, measured by throughput, energy efficiency, or cost. So, in practice, no it's not.

AWS actually made an interesting product, a distributed ledger that's 'trustless' as long as you trust Amazon, but with none of the overhead of blockchain so at least it's efficient

I think Ethereum is going big places, but the AWS ledger solution is probably also going to be good for smaller industries where competitors don't trust each other, they want a database that's shared, and they all might trust Amazon enough to control it (eg if they're all using AWS anyway)

(https://aws.amazon.com/qldb/)

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#93
post #35

We’re cobstantly dealing with environmental issues and global warming yet burn incredible amounts of energy and carbon compared to the value this gives us. It would probably be more environmentally friendly to not use crypto currencies then to stop using all the electricity you do each day...

incredible amounts of energy compared to the value this gives us Note that the value of ETH is higher than the value of the energy needed to mine it; that's why people mine. So is your complaint really about mispricing of energy (externalities) or about other people having different values than you?

"other people having different values than you" makes it sound like the value of ETH is purely a matter of personal opinion. It is, however, possible to fundamentally misprice an asset. I think OP is arguing that the ultimate real-world utility of ETH is not accurately reflected by its price.

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#94
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I wish people would look at less energy consuming proofs of work that still allow us real world evidence of decentralization. Are there any candidates for this? I can't imagine a PoW problem where you can't get ahead by throwing more computers at it.

It's called a zkSNARK. One proves they performed any computation with a constant size proof of the result.

But most of the energy consumption is in the work, not the proof.

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#95
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This time bomb has, however, functioned more like an alarm clock with a snooze button. In October 2017, when mining time had already nearly doubled to 30 seconds, the Ethereum team reset the clock, delaying PoW’s doomsday by about 12 months. And they will likely hit snooze again shortly. How can Ethereum be decentralized if they can so easily keep changing it? From the minute they decided to back out The DAO's mist…

And many crypto-anarchists discovered that day that most people did not care about decentralization.

But if decentralization doesn't matter, then what's the point of these technologies? One can build these things much, much more efficiently if centralization is fine. Financial exchanges have been doing that for years. E.g., if you look at the LMAX approach, they can hit TPS rates something like 1,000,000 times faster than common blockchains: https://martinfowler.com/articles/lmax.html

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#96
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see it less of a computing platform and more like the spinning table from the beginning of Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom. The goal isn't to compute faster or better than others, it's for parties with competing interests to trust the computations that have taken place.

It's a git with stored procedures that can push commits.

It's a hammer and nails. /s

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#97
post #41

> To make their intentions clear, Ethereum’s core developers reprogrammed their PoW code to create an exponential rise in mining difficulty. Known as the “Difficulty Bomb,” it began slowing the creation of new transaction blocks in late 2016 and was expected to bring ether mining to a grinding halt a few years thereafter. > This time bomb has, however, functioned more like an alarm clock with a snooze button. In Octo…

It's the ironic twist at the heart of crypto: a centralized system built on implicit trust and community standards is actually required to build a functioning economy. Participating in any particular blockchain is only as valuable as the community around it. So while forking is always an option, a fork will only be worth following if comes with a functional community with agreed-upon standards.

So you can (try to) decentralize the process of verifying that everyone is playing fair (whatever that means in your system), but so long as you all want to trade with each other, you must have a centralized authority of some sort, to decide what "playing fair" means.

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#98
post #41

> To make their intentions clear, Ethereum’s core developers reprogrammed their PoW code to create an exponential rise in mining difficulty. Known as the “Difficulty Bomb,” it began slowing the creation of new transaction blocks in late 2016 and was expected to bring ether mining to a grinding halt a few years thereafter. > This time bomb has, however, functioned more like an alarm clock with a snooze button. In Octo…

I think the centralisation issue with most cryptocurrencies is quite interesting. Almost all of them have a generally accepted organization that controls their development. This organization can make large-scale changes but controversial ones usually lead to breakaway forks. Theoretically these forks could be more valuable than the one controlled by the organization. In practice if a fork wants to be successful it's going to need its own organization.

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#99
post #24

Proof-of-Stake is indeed a good thing, and a worthy focus of the article. From the article we read " the long-term hope is that apps built from them will eventually make Ethereum the ultimate cloud-computing platform. " Ethereum does not claim to be a computing platform in the same way that AWS is; it's for low-complexity business logic only. I think it's misleading to use "ultimate cloud-computing platform" to descr…

Ethereum claims to be the "World Computer" that lets you build "Unstoppable Applications". If that doesn't sound like an AWS competitor then I don't know.

I use quite a lot of AWS - and there's precisely zero chance I'll ever migrate, say, a mobile app backend platform to an Ethereum "unstoppable application"...

There are quite probably innovative new things that can be built using Etherium's "world computer", but my guess is that almost _none_ of what's currently running on (and paying for) AWS resources will move to it.

Re: Ethereum Plans to Cut Its Energy Consumption by 99 Percent

#100

We’re cobstantly dealing with environmental issues and global warming yet burn incredible amounts of energy and carbon compared to the value this gives us. It would probably be more environmentally friendly to not use crypto currencies then to stop using all the electricity you do each day...

If we're going that way how about not having an economic system that predicates social stability on growth? The very essence of how our society is structured is antithetical to environmental stewardship, forget a few people playing around on computers.

Growth in the economy is not necessarily predicated on growth in consumption of natural resources. Those two things tend to be correlated in modern society, but they're not inextricably linked; we don't necessarily have to give up on the idea of economic growth in order to preserve the environment.
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