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Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

techcrunch.com

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Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#61

Post by skh »

X-Istence wrote: post #35
skh wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t believe this is correct on iOS and it isn’t correct on the Apple TV. In iOS you need to go to Settings -> iTunes & App Store -> tap on your Apple ID at the top of the screen -> tap on view Apple ID -> scroll to subscriptions and tap on that It’s not obvious or intuitive in my opinion.

That's the same as going to iTunes Store -> Sroll Down to Apple ID -> Tap Apple ID -> View Apple ID -> Subscriptions on iOS... there is two ways to get to the same thing. You can also like the parent poster said, use App Store -> Profile Picture -> Tap Apple ID -> Subscriptions.

I didn’t know there was a profile pic in the App Store app until I checked again after reading your comment. I don’t have a profile pic setup so that’s probably why I never noticed the icon on the right hand side of the page. I never thought that could be clicked. It’s not obvious or intuitive to me.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#62

Post by Drdrdrq »

simplify wrote: post #34
sundvor wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anything is easy once you know how to do it. :P

Not necessarily. Have you ever tried cancelling a cable or internet service over the phone?

Yes. In EU it's a piece of cake, as there are laws that protect consumers from companies.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#63

Post by DennisAleynikov »

freedomben wrote: post #47
lathiat wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple policies explicitly forbid this. While you can use subscriptions from on the website, the app cannot in any way suggest that you do that, nor can it link to a page that directly (one click away) lets you do it.

Wow, that's interesting. Suddenly the class action lawsuit against Apple claiming they've abused their monopoly makes a lot more sense (not saying I agree with it, just that it makes more sense. I neither agree nor disagree: I'm way too ill informed to have an opinion).

this is precisely why apple gets these tax complaints. their platform is hostile to users trying to have choice on their platform. players like netflix are the only ones able and willing to stand up to apples practices in running a hyper controlling app store with bizzare monetary policies.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#64

Post by madrox »

I've worked on a streaming service that did in-app subscriptions. I've written up my experiences before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17831188

I wonder if Apple is letting this slide because it's enough money that Netflix would feel sufficiently motivated to spend lots of money to take Apple to court over it. Apple could lose a lot more than a billion a year if the law sides against them, which is a likely outcome. They would have to let everyone pick their payment provider. Everyone from Stripe to Paypal would rush in with better and better payment terms.

Better to keep anyone capable of winning a legal challenge against them happy.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#65

Post by ehsankia »

skh wrote: post #2

I wonder how much money it costs Apple to handle subscription payments/cancellations for Netflix and other streaming services. I prefer to handle subscription through Apple because cancelling such services is never difficult. I don’t know how it is on other countries but cancelling services in the U.S. can be a hellish experience. Personally, I’d be willing to pay the “Apple Tax” on top of a subscription services’ co…

Tell me about it. To cancel my NYT subscription, I had to swap my payment method to paypal, then literally block them from my Paypal. After which, they sent me no less than 10 emails, almost one per day for over a week.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#66

Post by makecheck »

I find it hard to blame anyone for leaving any store when there has been almost nothing of value added in years and things are even regressing. That 30% should have gone a lot further; after 10 years, I can’t even use two different search-and-sort criteria at once to find new apps (and I refuse to sit there and scroll through offensively-bad lists of useless results, much less buy them).

I am however not surprised by the slow rate of new features in stores because there still aren’t “tiers” for developers to willingly become early adopters of new store capabilities. When there are millions of apps, why does it make sense to delay any new feature until the infrastructure has grown to provide that feature to all million apps?

Clearly there should be a way to roll out enhanced storefronts to a few apps at a time. For example, charge early adopters/beneficiaries for complex new features and don’t roll them out to all apps right away (if ever).

And then, developers shouldn’t have to sacrifice 30% for features they don’t use, either. I’d rather have a tiny percentage as the base to provide only essential features, with infrastructure upgrade options! I should be able to give up some low X% for “basic payment processing and auto-installation on devices”, with an option of X+N% to provide “that, plus hosting of app preview videos and several dozen screenshot images”, a higher option of X+2N% for “all that, plus an increased chance of being featured”, etc.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#67

Post by izacus »

briandear wrote: post #55
writepub wrote: post #30

It's ludicrous for Apple to state they somehow increased business for Netflix, because they allowed "sign-up" via iOS. That's like Google claiming they allowed sign-up via chrome, or AT&T claiming they allowed sign up via their Network. Apple adds ZERO value via the app store, both for devs and for the consumers.

Except they do handle your billing, sales taxes (in every jurisdiction,) cancelations. They also deal with chargebacks as well. While a Netflix type company is perfectly capable of doing it themselves, it’s a stretch to say “ZERO” value or devs or consumers. As a consumer, so can go into my App Store account and instantly cancel any subscription. Try that with Angie’s List or any of the numerous newspapers (including…

Netflix deals with all that already for all of their other platforms, so what does Apple add here except for duplication of work and 30% of tax?

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#68

Post by gcb0 »

wand3r wrote: post #19

The Apple store seems good for small apps because the “tax” pays for discovery/marketing, distribution, billing & payment, lends credibility to the application, etc. This is especially true for single purchases. Recurring revenue is a much different proposition— even for small or first time apps. A player like netflix which handles it’s own marketing, payment and all other ancilliary services doesn’t need to anything…

> The Apple store seems good for small apps

that is fine if you ever show up as featured. Which is 1% of the apps, and even then, from already big companies after they spent the marketing money. Other than that, for distribution (really?) and payment, there are tons of alternatives/competition the small apps cannot even consider.

App store is nothing other than a racketeering scheme where you have to pay if you can't "protect" yourself against. It is "robber barons"/"ma-bell"/etc all over again.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#69

Post by philihp »

soneca wrote: post #33

Why call it "tax" if it is a fee? The article shows numbers based on a 30% fee when it explicitly says it is actually 15%. "meaning Apple was making around $700,000 by doing nothing other than allowing Netflix to offer subscriptions in its app" It seems a bit unfair also. I have no horse in this race, but the author seems to have

"Apple Tax" is a well defined colloquial term to refer to the markup Apple makes on its products because of their company branding and product reputation. I wouldn't credit the author with inventing this term—rather they are borrowing it for something that is actually more like a tax. When there's a transaction in the Apple domain, Apple levies a tax/fee/toll/duty. This isn't going away, and it's going to be heavy hitters like Netflix which pressure them to change. Let's hope the change takes a form other than an exemption specifically for Netflix.

Re: Netflix stops paying the ‘Apple tax’ on its $853M in annual iOS revenue

#70

Post by ken »

briandear wrote: post #55
writepub wrote: post #30

It's ludicrous for Apple to state they somehow increased business for Netflix, because they allowed "sign-up" via iOS. That's like Google claiming they allowed sign-up via chrome, or AT&T claiming they allowed sign up via their Network. Apple adds ZERO value via the app store, both for devs and for the consumers.

Except they do handle your billing, sales taxes (in every jurisdiction,) cancelations. They also deal with chargebacks as well. While a Netflix type company is perfectly capable of doing it themselves, it’s a stretch to say “ZERO” value or devs or consumers. As a consumer, so can go into my App Store account and instantly cancel any subscription. Try that with Angie’s List or any of the numerous newspapers (including…

Don't payment processors like Stripe handle billing, sales taxes across jurisdictions, cancellations, chargebacks, etc? And they charge 1/10th of what Apple does.
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