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How the Valley treats experienced people

rachelbythebay.com

261–270 of 508 posts

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#261
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you but if a startup really wants people working 80 hours a week, then a family man who wants to work 40 hrs isn't a good match for the firm.

There exists no good match for a company that pays their employees for 40 hours but demands 80.

As far a I understand many places pay in DreamStuff

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#262
A few questions about this article. 1) is this hyperbole or is it a generalization that seems to follow the 80/20 rule? 2) I can’t imagine that there are enough jobs in SV that could consistently churn out millionaires- right? I would think that maybe some fraction of 1% of the people there hit the start up lotto. 3) I’m guessing this article mentioned here was scrubbed from the internet, but I would be curious to read it. 4) I enjoy working most of the time. Sure there are crappy days but I don’t think I would live a healthy lifestyle were I to be well enough off to not work at age 50. 5) if SV is really generally like this, why would someone want to be there? Is it just to get a shot at launching the next billion dollar company?

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#263
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically I would be fine with that but the recruitment agents (and everyone else) kept telling me to aim high.

The higher offer you get, the more the recruiter gets paid. Consider the interests of the advice giver.

It's a strong red flag that you are seriously underpaid if the recruiter is insisting on asking for more.

The recruiter has little interest in you being paid more. He's strongly incentivized to push candidates toward the average of the company.

Going over average is risking the company to bail out, too expensive. Going under average is undermining your credibility and leaving commission on the table.

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what does that value imply about ppl without kids? That they should be putting more hours in or have less flexible schedules? Why not have resonable work schedules for everyone, children or not. I just dont' get why employers have to come up with discriminatory policies for the 'good of the economy'. I would rather support a transparent 'tax childess ppl more' govt policies that these insidious "values". Whatever…

I think you might have misunderstood the suggestion. Giving people enough time to manage a family is different from giving more time to people who have families. An employer might prefer having employees with children for a variety of reason and mostly would treat "family benefits" as method to hire older more experienced people.

> An employer might prefer having employees with children

Isn't this straight up illegal? Only straight ppl can have children, for example.

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#265
post #68

Sometimes you don't make enough money to retire early from a combination of bad luck and poor financial decisions. In my career, I followed a pattern of going to a company just a bit too late to get the really low priced options. I've ended up with dozens of former co-workers who are multimillionaires. I had a family and was (in hindsight) too conservative about when I went to a company. I also was a "paper" milliona…

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Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's funny is that many young people in the industry now would never think of staying at one place for 3-5 years cause they don't want to invest the time. A neighbor of mine is in his 60s and lost his job the same way. He can run rings around anyone I know but he can't find a job or even get an interview. Bjarne Stroustrup, the C++ creator, wrote a blog post about going for a job interview and being told he "didn't…

Not being able to have an interview is a red flag. Companies can't tell the age from a resume. If they can, take off the date of birth, remove the year on your degrees and don't list experiences beyond 20 years.

I've been given this advice and I'm skeptical. You can only mask things to a certain degree, it can make you look like you're hiding something (which you are), and the hiring manager will figure it out soon enough in any case. If they really want to age discriminate you're probably better off finding out sooner than later anyway. In any case, later career jobs tend to come from personal networks anyway. My resume was just a formality for any interview I've had in the last 20 years.

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#267
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is still possible the older person is going to become a wizard later, but the question is: if they have it in them, why aren’t they a wizard already? The vast majority of coders are not and will never be a "wizard". And that's OK. You can still be valuable to a company if you aren't a recent college graduate or a wizard. Edit: also, be ready to pay through the nose for any actual wizard you want to hire. They ca…

My experience over 25 years suggests that wizards can readily command 1.5-2x and deliver beyond 10x. If you can find and engage them, they're one of the best semi-secret bargains in tech.

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Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#268
post #88

If one thinks 35+ is to old to code, well I have news for you. At 35+ you learn how to manage time and prioritize better. Life throws another ranch in your bucket of problems, marriage and children. When you are young, you are hired as an engineer to work 40 hours, which we all know very well that working for startups that means 80 hours or you are not putting good effort. Well with a family that’s not possible, as y…

I don't discriminate on age but realistically someone is not senior until they have 10 years experience. That generally puts them in their 30s. The younger ones can overwork themselves, job hop, write bad code. And then an experienced coder can sigh and fix it.

You can have a senior programmer in their 30s and a junior programmer in their 50s, if the latter is a career-changer fresh out of a coding bootcamp, or with a couple of MOOCs under their belt. Age is often correlated with seniority, but correlation is not causation...

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 34, left my 7 years relation two years ago, am gay and never thought I could have kids and am not planning on having kids any time soon. This kind of thinking about that the traits that one develops with age and experience only come about with raising a family kind of worries me, I have a pretty good idea on what I'm missing on since absolutely all my good friends from university and most of my close friends from…

> I just don't think I'm in te proper situation to do it. In my experience there are two kinds of pre-kid people: those who aren't ready for it and those who lie about being ready for it.

Irritating attitude and assumptions. Even the wording of "being ready for it" is ignorant. There are many, many successful people who do not have or do not want or will not ever want children.

Re: How the Valley treats experienced people

#270
I think the truth is that older, more experienced people do not provide visible value.

For example, do you think it's undergraduates who come up with the design and architecture for AWS? No, it's years of pain and lessons that go into it. Then the elders productize their pain and lessons so that undergrads never need to learn it.

This is why FAANG want undergrads: their processes keep noobs from making super stupid mistakes, through the law of large numbers, some survive, feel some pain, learn and make it to architect level enough to affect the next iteration of AWS/Google/Azure. At the same time, the company saves on salaries/benefits/work-life balance.

It won't change because it works. Act accordingly.

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