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Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

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Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#81

Post by xte »

blhack wrote: post #36

This same story played out 10 or so years ago with Wikileaks, PayPal, and major card processors and banks. The sad realization was that private companies can control who gets to speak very effectively. Lots of people hoped cryptocurrency would fix this, but so far it hasn't.

I fear that cryptocurrency will be even worse: imaging how big the blockchain can became if used as main currency; who can really operate on it the if not very few super-giants that offer "broker services" like today's online wallets services? Also see the actual hw trend: we get more and more closed platforms more and more stuffed with proprietary fw, how can you trust even your UEFI machine or even fw-enabled keyboard, no matter how strongly encrypted your files are... You can't even trust your mobile phone nearby your keyboard since we have enough POCs of how to determinate keys pressed with a simple audio analyze...

The sole currency I can trust is paper one: it can be stolen, sure, but if you have it in hand and is legal to use it you can exchange money so exchange values/goods without big dictators in the middle, it doesn't matter if they act for good or bad.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#82

Post by asabjorn »

AllegedAlec wrote: post #72
asabjorn wrote: post #64

Patreon has been on a spree to ban people that think the wrong way. Matt Christiansen had a call [1] with Patreon to discuss their banning of Sargon of Akkad. Sargon was notified of the banning by his patrons, not Patreon, and had no recourse to challenge the decision. In the call Patreon made it clear that their platform is; 1) explicitly anti free-speech 2) is not a free market (they can ban you for arbitrary reaso…

Although Patreon is an excessively scummy company, there is some evidence that some of these bans were forced by Mastercard and Visa.

In the call with Matt they said that what they did here conform with their corporate values and goals, as they don’t want to allow creators they politically disagree with for branding reasons. If therefore doesn’t matter if this was true in some of the many cases.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#83

Post by lotsofpulp »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #76
tokyodude wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get your point that most businesses are closed but I didn't know it was mandatory or required triple pay. Is that true? Disneyland is open on Christmas. Most movie theaters are open on Christmas. I think most convenience stores, many groceries stores, and most gas stations are open on Christmas.

> I get your point that most businesses are closed but I didn't know it was mandatory or required triple pay. Is that true? No, neither of those things is true. Triple pay would be very odd under any circumstances.

It’s really amazing to me how many people can’t be bothered to spend 5 min on learning the basics of their country’s labor laws.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#84

Post by xte »

Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #65
y4mi wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really didn't. Bitcoins ledger is public, marking every transaction from who to whom the money went. Yes, it's originally only the wallet id that is public, but this id only needs to be matched once to a person... And don't even start with exchanges. They have exactly the same problem as any private entity such as PayPal or patreon has

Couldn't one simply use the other currencies where ledger is not public, if the privacy is needed? Like Zcash, Dash or Monero (no affiliation, I'm just listing options to clearly show that public ledger is in technological sense not a problem). I think that many of these problems stem from censorship, not need of privacy.

You can't for a simple reason: to use them you need a combination of hw, sw and connectivity that's largely proprietary and can't be considered safe...

You may trust your FOSS-only OS, your FOSS "wallet", but how you can trust your hw? How easy a country can look out citizens from internet services?

Mesh network and open hardware exists but mostly at a marginal and embryonic stage...

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#85

Post by syshum »

AllegedAlec wrote: post #72
asabjorn wrote: post #64

Patreon has been on a spree to ban people that think the wrong way. Matt Christiansen had a call [1] with Patreon to discuss their banning of Sargon of Akkad. Sargon was notified of the banning by his patrons, not Patreon, and had no recourse to challenge the decision. In the call Patreon made it clear that their platform is; 1) explicitly anti free-speech 2) is not a free market (they can ban you for arbitrary reaso…

Although Patreon is an excessively scummy company, there is some evidence that some of these bans were forced by Mastercard and Visa.

There is speculation that Mastercard may have put some pressure on them

I have seen zero actual evidence for MasterCard, and no speculation for Visa, so I would love to see citation for your evidence?

There was Speculation for MC in the JihadWatch banning, but MC has publicly said they were not behind it I believe.

PayPal on the other hand probably is, PayPal has been on a moral Authoritarian left war for over a decade now

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#86

Post by xte »

mirimir wrote: post #57

Being someone who pays ~zero attention to Twitter, and very little to "politics", I had no clue that there was a shitstorm happening over "censorship" by Patreon. (Although I think that it probably is censorship, I'm not sure, so scare quotes.) Anyway, so searx.me shows me a NY Times article from today.[0] And it contains these ironic bits: > Patreon takes a highly personal approach to policing speech. While Google a…

A small note: how can ever a private company claim the right to decide about "hate speech", "illegal contents" etc? If they have suspects they have to go knock the police/other public authority door to signal what they suspect and after comply to the public authority decision.

Nowadays to many people do not comprehend really this super-important concept... And many countries try to take advantage of it pushing private power.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#87

Post by syshum »

EGreg wrote: post #52
blhack wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised infowars hasnt created their own patreon clone.

Wasn’t Jordan Peterson gonna launch one before Christmas? https://amp.businessinsider.com/jordan-peterson-says-hell-la...

I do not remember him ever putting a date on it, business insider has a habit for publishing less than credible info

All I have seen is "coming soon" or "we are working on something" with no exact time table or dates

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#89

Post by jrs95 »

xte wrote: post #86
mirimir wrote: post #57

Being someone who pays ~zero attention to Twitter, and very little to "politics", I had no clue that there was a shitstorm happening over "censorship" by Patreon. (Although I think that it probably is censorship, I'm not sure, so scare quotes.) Anyway, so searx.me shows me a NY Times article from today.[0] And it contains these ironic bits: > Patreon takes a highly personal approach to policing speech. While Google a…

A small note: how can ever a private company claim the right to decide about "hate speech", "illegal contents" etc? If they have suspects they have to go knock the police/other public authority door to signal what they suspect and after comply to the public authority decision. Nowadays to many people do not comprehend really this super-important concept... And many countries try to take advantage of it pushing privat…

"Hate speech" doesn't have a legal definition in the United States that I am aware of. If it does, it's still covered by the first amendment and legal. So its not a question of Patreon determining what is legal, they're determining what is acceptable to them.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#90

Post by xte »

jrs95 wrote: post #89
xte wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A small note: how can ever a private company claim the right to decide about "hate speech", "illegal contents" etc? If they have suspects they have to go knock the police/other public authority door to signal what they suspect and after comply to the public authority decision. Nowadays to many people do not comprehend really this super-important concept... And many countries try to take advantage of it pushing privat…

"Hate speech" doesn't have a legal definition in the United States that I am aware of. If it does, it's still covered by the first amendment and legal. So its not a question of Patreon determining what is legal, they're determining what is acceptable to them.

Ok, so my point is how a private company can ever determinate what is acceptable or not for them of their customers activities or idea. I do not know how USA legislation works, in EU a private company can't "discriminate" their customers based on their own personal assumption. If you run a company you may refuse a new customer or you may found a way to break a contract with an actual customer but nothing "suddenly", unnoticed and arbitrary or you face big troubles in curt.
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