Why American cities are weirdly shaped • Hacker News Board

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#101

Post by wlll » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 6:50 PM UTC

captainbland wrote: post #4

chrisseaton wrote: post #2

My understanding is that a city boundary in the US is a big deal. The police force on either side can be completely different, things that can get you in a lot of trouble like gun laws can be different on either side, prices and taxes can be very different. In the UK a city boundary doesn't really mean anything. There might be a nice 'Welcome to X' sign but nothing really changes as it would in the US. I'm not even s…

It depends a lot I think. London's an interesting case, because depending on what part of London you're in you're dealing with a totally different police force - in the City of London, there's the City of London police but this only covers the square mile. Most of London is policed by the Metropolitan Police. Administratively, the City of London and everything else in London it's totally separate. The City has The Lo…

Interesting article/video on the City of London http://www.cgpgrey.com/blog/the-secret-city-of-london.html

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#102

Post by prostoalex » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:10 PM UTC

cjf4 wrote: post #49

chrisseaton wrote: post #2

My understanding is that a city boundary in the US is a big deal. The police force on either side can be completely different, things that can get you in a lot of trouble like gun laws can be different on either side, prices and taxes can be very different. In the UK a city boundary doesn't really mean anything. There might be a nice 'Welcome to X' sign but nothing really changes as it would in the US. I'm not even s…

>My understanding is that a city boundary in the US is a big deal. The police force on either side can be completely different, things that can get you in a lot of trouble like gun laws can be different on either side, prices and taxes can be very different. The biggest thing that changes is the school district. City schools tend to be worse than suburban counterparts, and that completely drives a cities ability to r…

That's a contributing factor, but unlikely the decisive one.

Some city schools are excellent, and business case for a private or a charter school is stronger in a city. There's also wider availability of various after-school programs.

There's the space concern for those who wouldn't mind a backyard and a pet or two, safety concern associated with letting the kids just play outside, transportation concern as far as effort required to drive them to school and various after-school programs.

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#103

Post by rounce » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:27 PM UTC

DFHippie wrote: post #41

mprev wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t there a welcome to Wales sign on one side of the city? I always find it fun driving over the border and suddenly you can araf at the gwasanethau for a paned o de.

I know no one else cares, and this isn't really my nit to pick, but "araf" is an adjective meaning "slow", not a verb, so you can't really "can" it at all.

Does welsh have a singular verb for this, and if so what is it?

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#104

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:31 PM UTC

mprev wrote: post #72

zazen wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sympathise with @chrisseaton's frustration. When you make a comment highlighting something that looks superficially similar but is actually irrelevant, that's going to tend to derail the conversation. If your comment was unworthy of a parry, maybe that's a hint that it was unworthy of being made in the first place. Please make an effort to be part of the signal not part of the noise, even if your brand of noise is…

The point is that chrisseaton said they didn’t know where the city of Chester ends and I mentioned that there’s a pretty big change of admin at the edge of the city (or, in this case, the borough of Chester and West Cheshire, as we are talking about administrative borders rather than cities). Basically, if you live in Chester and don’t know where the boundary is then it’s because you’re not looking at the signs. The…

[deleted]

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#105

Post by bobthepanda » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:34 PM UTC

prostoalex wrote: post #102

cjf4 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My understanding is that a city boundary in the US is a big deal. The police force on either side can be completely different, things that can get you in a lot of trouble like gun laws can be different on either side, prices and taxes can be very different. The biggest thing that changes is the school district. City schools tend to be worse than suburban counterparts, and that completely drives a cities ability to r…

That's a contributing factor, but unlikely the decisive one. Some city schools are excellent, and business case for a private or a charter school is stronger in a city. There's also wider availability of various after-school programs. There's the space concern for those who wouldn't mind a backyard and a pet or two, safety concern associated with letting the kids just play outside, transportation concern as far as ef…

Suburbs used to be regularly annexed into cities; in some places they still are.

This stops being the norm when desegregation occurs. Now that all races must be allowed to mix in schools, businesses and housing, whites flee to the suburbs, put up giant financial barriers in the form of zoning, and refuse to be annexed.

These days overt racial politics is now dogwhistled as concerns about crime or undesirables or culture. But that's a big heaping portion of why things are the way they are.

(This only really applies to suburbs within the same state of the main city; New Jersey, most of which is suburbs, would not face the same annexation pressure since the main cities their suburbs are part of (Philadelphia and New York) are not in their state and can't legally annex them.)

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#106

Post by scarejunba » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:47 PM UTC

robertAngst wrote: post #34

mc32 wrote: post #9

The article implies that if cities could unilaterally annex twrritory they would and that presumanly would result in nicer city shapes (boundaries) as well as more importantly better and cheaper services due to elimination of redundancies. Interestingly the article claims both rich and poor people are reluctant to give up their enclaves/ independence due to power, momey, and other aspects such as education.

My city is one of the best in our area. Best schools, safe, and has a high property tax. 10 miles south of us is Detroit. Where the Detroit voters re-elected Kawammi kilpatrick despite having constant public corruption. Do I want those voters to impact my schools? Do those voters want to spend 9,000$/yr on property taxes? Its far too simplistic to think that there is only redundancies at play.

Kinda douchy to spell his name like that on purpose. Kinda ignorant to do so by accident.

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#107

Post by darkpuma » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:51 PM UTC

daveFNbuck wrote: post #77

mikestew wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s my point: why do I care where the strip is legally located? Casinos have reason to care, I don’t. And if you’re discharging a firearm, yeah, you better make for damned sure you’re allowed (what was my one example that wasn’t related to race?). Your linked example calls out towns I’ve lived near (lived in Gastonia), and the reason there’s a need for such lawyers is due to morons that think ownership of a firear…

> it’s a safe bet that if you’re within city limits anywhere in the U. S. you best assume discharging a firearm is illegal (it probably is) until proven otherwise. That's an example of you having to care about which city you're in. You can't just rely on your knowledge of federal or state law there.

> "That's an example of you having to care about which city you're in."

Not really. If you're worried first and foremost about common sense, then you don't need to worry about the law. Common sense would preclude discharging a firearm in any urban or suburban area, unless you are inside a commercial firing range. It doesn't matter which city you're in, because you shouldn't be doing that in any city no matter what that particular city's laws are. Even if through some oversight that city neglected to create any laws concerning discharging firearms, common sense should still prevent you from doing it.

If you're on some deep rural farm and want to know whether it's legal or not to set up a private firing range, then you definitely need to consult your local law; there may be unintuitive laws about the distance you need to be from other property, roads, etc. But as far as shooting guns anywhere near a city is concerned, common sense should be enough to keep you on the safe side of the law.

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#108

Post by scarejunba » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:52 PM UTC

xte wrote: post #93

crooked-v wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand how Japanese work culture is supposed to be a result of their city designs.

It's a result of Japan environment (not only natural), they are too much and too concentrated as a result they can't live relaxed, they can only stress themselves. Few that born or arrive to a "comfort position" tend to exceed in any behavior, others whip themselves to the extreme. That's why we read about people who die working too much, who close themselves in their room for months or years, they use big load of an…

Not convincing. The inner boroughs of London are as dense as Tokyo and a dream to live in. Your hypotheses have not faced adequate tests of falsification yet.

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#109

Post by huehehue » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 7:53 PM UTC

tboyd47 wrote: post #90

bane wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can depend on the particular U.S. State. It's sometimes useful for non-Americans to think of the U.S. like a federation of weak semi-autonomous countries. Each state more or less runs their own affairs unless there's some federal interest in which case the national interest overrides the state one. What this means for this topic is that states organize their territories in sometimes different ways that can seem so…

> It's sometimes useful for non-Americans to think of the U.S. like a federation of weak semi-autonomous countries. That may have been true in the 18th and 19th century, but since the early 1900s, I don't think it's accurate to say that anymore. Nearly every state power has been checked by the federal court system at some point during the 20th century [0]. I didn't know about the Police-Jury system, but it's surely t…

Within the bounds of federal law but still quite different. Guns, marijuana, open containers (alcohol), driving (80mph is reckless driving in VA, but totally legal elsewhere), abortion, and more all vary by state.

I've even heard of state border checks in the southwest (mostly "papers please" immigrant checks...). Still not nearly as tight-knit as one would think.

Re: Why American cities are weirdly shaped

#110

Post by DFHippie » Sun, Dec 23, 2018, 8:05 PM UTC

rounce wrote: post #103

DFHippie wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know no one else cares, and this isn't really my nit to pick, but "araf" is an adjective meaning "slow", not a verb, so you can't really "can" it at all.

Does welsh have a singular verb for this, and if so what is it?

I don't understand the question.