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Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

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Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#281

Post by basilgohar »

jwildeboer wrote: post #161

So it seems that Slack is going through their log files and closing down accounts that have used IP addresses that are considered to be in embargoed countries. I base that assumption on various comments here and on Twitter. If true, it is definitely the worst way to do. It doesn't take into account any circumstantial evidence that could explain the use of such an IP address (vacation, VPN, BGP or a mistake in the geo…

This is very disturbing for ways that some folks might not realize. One of the servers I've leased was assigned an IP address range whose reverse DNS (i.e., PTR records) ended in .ir.

I only discovered this because I was trying to use Google's CLI tools and got blocked, with the shocking message that access from embargoed countries was not allowed. I was utterly confused given that my server, myself, and anything to do with my hosting was all contained completely within the US. After studying the message and finally figuring out after some time the problem, I reported it to my host and they promptly submitted a correction to that, and the issue was resolved.

But had I somehow used this host to access Slack, I would find my own account deleted, if what is being deduced here is correct.

Deleting or disabling accounts is completely the wrong approach. The absolutely maximum that could be done is BLOCKING ACCESS (i.e., actually embargoing) from these restricted IPs. Disabling or deleting accounts is stupid and shows that Slack has a profound MISUNDERSTANDING of how the Internet works, i.e., it's not perfect. This is exactly akin to using an IP address for identification. IP addresses, and hostnames, are not identification of people and cannot nor should be used for these kinds of heavy-handed, punitive punishments.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#282

Post by [deleted] »

corebit wrote: post #233
spacehome wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not entitled to Slack's infrastructure, no matter how much you came to depend on it for your day-to-day life.

Well that's not strictly true. Presumably there is a contract of some sort, and Slack must abide by it, entitling users to Slack's infrastructure to some degree. It's not completely arbitrary. Plus there're notions of estoppel potentially at play.

[deleted]

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#284

Post by walterbell »

PakG1 wrote: post #274
walterbell wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do people export/backup messages from Slack?

Migrating to Mattermost from Slack and transitioning all the data is easy. My team at work transitioned to Mattermost a few years ago. https://docs.mattermost.com/administration/migrating.html#mi...

Thanks. This seems to be the important part:

> Generate a Slack “Export” file from Slack > Administration > Workspace settings > Import/Export Data > Export > Start Export.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#285

Post by mirimir »

Raphmedia wrote: post #259
mirimir wrote: post #190

So is this really an accurate title? It seems most likely that Slack has geolocated IP addresses from account access logs, and closed accounts with hits from sanctioned countries. Perhaps going back years. That in itself seems over the top. But it doesn't constitute ethnic profiling. But if someone has a counterexample, that would be OK too.

That's a bit scary. As a developer, I often test websites performances / features using a VPN. Since Slack is the platform developers use to communicate, it often stays open as I test "from other countries". My Slack IP log likely has accesses from all over the world.

I'd say be careful with that! At a minimum, put the VPN in a separate VM, so nothing to Slack could get routed through it.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#286

Post by saryant »

gaius wrote: post #135
icebraining wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it wasn't given up, what would the lawsuit complain be, and what would one gain from it if it succeeds? Isn't Slack legally entitled to shut down any accounts at any time?

GDPR holds that you own your data and are entitled to be provided a download of it. Not sure what the Canadian equivalent is, if any.

Even if the GDPR applied in this situation, Slack is trying to obey US sanctions. I’d wager a guess GDPR can’t force a company to violate those laws.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#287

Post by zmk_ »

gaius wrote: post #135
icebraining wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it wasn't given up, what would the lawsuit complain be, and what would one gain from it if it succeeds? Isn't Slack legally entitled to shut down any accounts at any time?

GDPR holds that you own your data and are entitled to be provided a download of it. Not sure what the Canadian equivalent is, if any.

And it applies to people who are in the EU. So all these people have to do to get their data is to book a plane ticket into any EU country.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#288

Post by natch »

jordank wrote: post #80

My wife’s Slack account was closed yesterday. She created the account while traveling in Cuba (legally) years ago and hasn’t been back to Cuba or any other sanctioned country since. She is a cofounder of an org that uses Slack heavily and has now lost access to all her messages and files from the past couple years of work. There appears to be no appeal process here.

So is it related to her ethnicity as this guy is claiming it is in his case?

If not maybe everyone can consider that maybe Slack’s actions for the Iranian guy have some basis other than “his ethnicity.”

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#289

Post by hnauz »

blindwatchmaker wrote: post #277
hnauz wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not what happened at all, that's why it's hard to take him seriously. He makes it look like Slack went out of their way to look at all of their users and check of what race they are to ban those who are Iranians, when they just made a geoip check.

Assuming that for some reason I should take your word over his, banning for "having logged on in Iran at some point" is, effectively, banning for ethnicity.

It only is if you think someone who has ever set foot on Iran is an ethnic Irani. You just have to look at this HN thread to see that is false, as this problem also applies to other embargoed countries.

Re: Slack closes account of an Iranian user living in Canada

#290

Post by jellicle »

elmo2you wrote: post #250

1. The export control regulations apply to companies and individuals who do business with any of the sanctioned countries. 2. Discrimination based on ethnicity, religion or political views is forbidden by law. In the absence of proof that this user had business with Iran (or any of the other sanctioned countries) through Slack's platform, the export control regulations do not apply. If the user has business with Iran…

> Ergo, the only thing left here is that Slack broke the law that forbids discrimination based on ethnicity.

That's not how it works. Even if Slack is mistaken in their belief that export regulations apply, their action is still taken in that belief, which is not legally-discriminatory.

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