Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

theintercept.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 372 posts

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#31

Post by josteink »

dmitrygr wrote: post #4
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, every part of this story really happened because of Ryan's coverage. His reveal is what brought it to the attention of other Google employees, members of Congress, and human rights groups. And eventually, it appears key information he released is what also led to it's effective closure. It's a true testament to the power of quality investigative journalism.

> His reveal is what brought it to > the attention of other Google > employees Sad truth. And yet, >

You’re free to internal debate.

Just be prepared to be fired over stating elementary biological facts, like how men and women are different.

I bet James Damore really appreciates how he used this freedom in this tolerant company.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#32

Post by sftwds »

president wrote: post #29
sftwds wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assumed that Apple has very similar weight on a resume as Google, is that not correct?

I'm sure there is weight in having Apple on your resume but Google engineers are generally sought after for SE positions. I hear managers pining over Google candidates all the time at my company.

As a Silicon Valley outsider that surprises me. I've heard that interviews at all the FAANG companies are all difficult (as an aside, why is Microsoft never in that list??). For organizations the size of Google and Apple, there are bound to be employees who squeaked by their interviews and would not have been hired at the other company. Why does "Google" on a resume look better than "Apple"? Is the Google interview that much more selective than Apple's?

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#33

Post by aaomidi »

So many people here only look at the business cost of what Google wanted to do and don't care about the human cost.

It's great that you were born in a western country with a good understanding of freedom and your rights. The majority of the world don't have these conditions. Your "business" decision effects billions of people in the world.

I was born and mostly raised in Iran. "Business" decisions from companies that sold the government DPI equipment made sense for them, their shareholders, and their investors. But at what cost? Iran is a very young country in terms of population age. Many Iranians simply didn't have the opportunity to grow simply because a few companies wanted more $$$ in their pockets.

If you in any way support these decisions while having complete freedom not to, then you're complicit. You're part of the reason so many countries have a lost/dark generation. You're part of the cause of so much suffering in the world.

Good on you Google Engineers who stood against making a few $ of profit to stop the suffering of many, many people.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#34

Post by creato »

tomatotomato37 wrote: post #7
izacus wrote: post #5

Great! So will Apple employees walk out next in protest of Apple assisting Chinese government by giving them iMessage and iCloud data? Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-apple-icloud-insigh...

Apple has a very significant manufactoring presence in China, so unfortunately they can't cleanly separate from China like Google can without risking retaliation

This is exactly why companies shouldn't be involved with business in China.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#35

Post by ApolloFortyNine »

pfortuny wrote: post #27
izacus wrote: post #5

Great! So will Apple employees walk out next in protest of Apple assisting Chinese government by giving them iMessage and iCloud data? Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-apple-icloud-insigh...

We are talking about google here.

It's hypocritical to attack Google for moving back to China after pulling out 7 years ago while other companies have been there continuously for years without backlash.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#36

Post by baybal2 »

> Google has used 265.com as a honeypot for market research, storing information about Chinese users’ searches before sending them along to Baidu.

I can't resist to post a meme here

https://www.news.com.au/technology/online/censorship/chinas-...

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#37

Post by ocdtrekkie »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #35
pfortuny wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are talking about google here.

It's hypocritical to attack Google for moving back to China after pulling out 7 years ago while other companies have been there continuously for years without backlash.

It's not hypocritical, because taking issue with Google's behavior and cheering for them losing here doesn't mean we support other companies still being in China.

"But what about Apple" is a very specific conversational tactic, accurately named: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#38

Post by reaperducer »

tomatotomato37 wrote: post #7
izacus wrote: post #5

Great! So will Apple employees walk out next in protest of Apple assisting Chinese government by giving them iMessage and iCloud data? Source: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-apple-icloud-insigh...

Apple has a very significant manufactoring presence in China, so unfortunately they can't cleanly separate from China like Google can without risking retaliation

Apple has a very significant manufactoring presence in China, so unfortunately they can't cleanly separate from China like Google can without risking retaliation

Apple can walk away from China whenever it wants to. Apple is the one company in the entire world best equipped with the cash to make this kind of public stand. But it doesn't want to because doing so will cost a lot of that money.

The only thing stopping Apple from closing its Chinese stores, and moving manufacturing to another country is fear of the faceless shareholder bots that have no AI for morality, and will punish Apple for doing the right thing.

Every time I see Tim Cook on stage patting himself on the back for making some minor environmental improvement because it's the right thing to do, I can't help but think it's all a farce because incremental environmental improvements aren't even low-hanging fruit. They're the fruit that has already fallen from the tree and rolled through his front door into his kitchen.

If Mr. Cook and the rest of his company want to impress, then do something hard.

Disclosure: Apple shareholder, with morality, but not enough shares for Apple to care.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#40

Post by fatjokes »

"Traditional" companies like Amazon, Apple and Oracle heavily punish employees for banding together, freely communicating and protesting like this, so they would never have the opportunity to protest controversial projects like this. I fear the main lesson corporate leaders will take from this is to lockdown on employee freedom.
Post reply on HN