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Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

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Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#71

Post by hyperbovine »

jasongullickson wrote: post #43

To me this is just another reason (of many) that travelers should consider general aviation (charter, etc.) as an alternative to commercial airline travel. The straight financial cost may be higher but avoiding all of this sort of nonsense has its rewards, and remember that most GA operators are locally-owned smallish businesses that appreciate your support and treat their passengers like customers and not like priso…

The GA safety record is 50 times poorer than that of commercial airlines. (http://philip.greenspun.com/flying/safety) I'll take the rectal probe, thank you.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#72

Post by CapitalistCartr »

tomjen3 wrote: post #58

It seems that the best way to get around this would be to make life unbearable for the TSA agents. The politicians can't be reached. While physically assaulting them would be very satisfying, simply freezing them out socially would properly be a better tactic, since it is impossible to arrest people for.

"The politicians can't be reached."

Of course they can! Mail, email, they can certainly be reached, and right now they're extra sensitive to issues that upset their constituents.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#73

Post by Qz »

jules wrote: post #42
roc wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole invasive pat-down is just a way to intimidate and humiliate people away from that choice. This is the last straw for me, personally. I'll just be vacationing closer to home now or working old-school road trips into my plans. Maybe if the outraged take a few less flights a year, the vacation, airline and union lobbies will take up the cause.

For whom on HN are pat downs intimidating and/or humiliating? I personally don't mind it at all, but I can understand that they could be a problem for somebody. I'm much more worried about CCTV's everywhere, cell phone tracking, internet usage tracking, tracking cars with cameras on highways that read number plates, etc. All these tools are extremely well suited for keeping a dictator in place. I'm afraid that if we…

Other recent posts on HN have said that the TSA is planning to start more thorough pat-downs specifically to discourage people from opting out. You may not mind the pat-down right now, but I'm not sure you'll be saying the same thing a few months from now.

Good thing I'm too poor to fly these days.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#74

Post by mike-cardwell »

barrkel wrote: post #37
mike-cardwell wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought only women operated the machinery where women were scanned and only men, where the men are scanned?

Gender doesn't necessarily determine sexual orientation; the machines are required to have facilities to store and transmit images; and besides, the mere power of forcefully suggesting someone submit to a strip search is titillation in itself, quite apart from viewing any resulting imagery.

I never said it did.

The implication of the comment I was replying to was that it was a bunch of men wanting to look at naked women. I just didn't see how that could be if you were only allowed to observe someone of the same sex...

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#75

Post by verdant »

If enough would choose opt out (despite the obvious intimidation tactics), then the entire process would become so inefficient that an easy, efficient alternate would be provided (or the scanners removed altogether). It would likely take a majority of people opting out though.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#76

Post by mike-cardwell »

travisp wrote: post #39
mike-cardwell wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought only women operated the machinery where women were scanned and only men, where the men are scanned?

What's your citation for that? I've never heard of this and there's no mention of it on the TSA website.

I don't have one. That's why I didn't claim it as fact.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#77

Post by steveklabnik »

jules wrote: post #66
steveklabnik wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me. It's insane. It serves no purpose other than to intimidate and harasses normal citizens just trying to get from point A to point B. The fact that I'm assumed to be that stupid, plus the 1984-esqe overtones really, really gets to me.

Right. So it's not so much the physical aspects of pat downs, but the reasons behind the pat downs?

I mean, I was raised Catholic, so I'm not exactly the model of immodesty, but yes, its not the 'omg they'll touch my junk' part as it is the infringement on basic human rights part.

And being reminded that some people think this is okay. And that most people accept it.

I have slightly unusual polititcal views, so such a visible reminder that I'm 'the only person who cares' really riles me up.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#78

Post by jtbigwoo »

Flemlord wrote: post #67
pchristensen wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I echo tocomment - for someone who has only ever flown commercial, how would one go about finding and hiring a GA operator? What's kind of premium would you expect pay for a regional (eg Chicago to Detroit) flight or a longer flight (eg Chicago to LA)?

I'm also curious. Do you use a national charter company or do you have to contract directly with owner/pilots? How much does it cost? How fast is it compared to regular commercial travel?

A little over a decade ago, my company used a local charter company when Northwest's pilots went on strike. We were able to get a five-seat turboprop with two pilots for $2000 for 70 minute flight (about 400 miles.) A full-fare ticket on Northwest cost about $540 at the time. Our total travel time was cut in half--no ticketing, no security screening, no baggage claim. We even convinced the rental car companies to run our cars over to the charter office. All we had to do was say hello at the charter office and head on to the plane. This particular company also had seven- and ten-seaters which were slightly cheaper per person per hour. I assume the prices would be more expensive now. Anybody have experience with netjet or similar fractional ownership?

EDIT: Forgot to mention that the same flight on Northwest was 50 minutes in the air.

Re: Opt Out of a Body Scan? Then Brace Yourself

#80

Post by nano81 »

verdant wrote: post #75

If enough would choose opt out (despite the obvious intimidation tactics), then the entire process would become so inefficient that an easy, efficient alternate would be provided (or the scanners removed altogether). It would likely take a majority of people opting out though.

I think you overestimate government desire to eliminate inefficiency.
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