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Depression

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Re: Depression

#41

Post by w3gv »

mabbo wrote: post #18
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you tried Vitamin D and magnesium aminoacid chelate / orotate / citrate.

On the one hand, answers like this always seem to over-simplify. Oh hey just take this vitamin and the soul sucking demon that's been riding on your shoulder for years, decades, will magically go away. On the other, I spent nearly two decades of my life suffering from this horrendous illness, and nothing has helped as much as daily magnesium does. I take a big Magnesium pill, a men's health multivitamin and I add D i…

I'm going to try this. Thanks

Re: Depression

#42

Post by intralizee »

lsc wrote: post #27
intralizee wrote: post #14

As a programmer trying to imagine how I would construct & create depression for a simulation. I think it would make sense to have a negative state that turns "on or off" against the will, associated with unwanted thinking patterns, current life circumstances and some type of past trauma playing a big role in the illness. Anyone think of something different? I believe past trauma is the root cause and I doubt people h…

Huh. (to be clear, I'm no more qualified than you, probably less, I'm just a computer technician speculating about how the brain works;) I always felt like trying to fit my feelings into a logical model that had to do with other feelings was a losing game. As far as I can tell, how healthy I am in other ways matters more to my feelings than anything else; when I'm doing badly, little bad things seem huge; when I'm de…

I think our health and feelings of happiness or sadness are fundamentally outside of our control is reality. Since, I can argue people have no real control in life from deductive reasoning.

I assume nature with what's described as evolution, is similar to how us humans build our emotional state. I observe human characteristics such as greed, greatly theorized as a survival trait and speculate how it alters everything else depending on the individual. Basically everything to me is similar to code and where logic lives to be discovered.

The stigma with drugs from what I believe is if you require it to function forever. Honestly I have nothing against drugs if the person taking them is educated.

> I guess I think of bad feelings like any other kind of difficult to pinpoint bodily pain... something is wrong with me, but the thing that is wrong is often not the thing that hurts.

I like how you wrote this.

Re: Depression

#43

Post by ettercap18 »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #12
chongli wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't exactly fault the default response to be, "I don't get it. Just get off your butt and go for a jog. I always feel better when I do that." I've been living with depression for almost two decades now. I took up running a few years ago and you're right, it did make me feel good. But there was no way for me to keep it up through the Waterloo winters with mountains of snow, disgusting brown slush, and deadly black…

Have you tried Vitamin D and magnesium aminoacid chelate / orotate / citrate.

I second this approach.

I used to be extremely depressed. If you are low on a single vitamin or mineral it can mess you up.

Most of the food we eat now tends to be lower in key micronutrients. Add stress, caffeine, lack of sun, alcohol, lack of sleep and those micronutrients can get consumed or flushed out of your body fast.

Exercise can also deplete those key nutrients due to sweat.

Now I take a shotgun approach, supplement all vitamins and minerals and then begin trying to add more structure and discipline to my life to control the feeling of helplessness and chaos.

Depression is complicated.

Re: Depression

#44

Post by ettercap18 »

mabbo wrote: post #19
intralizee wrote: post #14

As a programmer trying to imagine how I would construct & create depression for a simulation. I think it would make sense to have a negative state that turns "on or off" against the will, associated with unwanted thinking patterns, current life circumstances and some type of past trauma playing a big role in the illness. Anyone think of something different? I believe past trauma is the root cause and I doubt people h…

> I believe past trauma is the root cause and I doubt people have depression if they haven't had some type of experience they would classify as trauma. I had a great childhood. Amazing parents. A good upper middle class life. Good friends. No real trauma to speak of at all. By 12, if I'd shared with a doctor what was going on in my head they'd have slapped me with the depression label. I wasn't healthy. There was no…

I got very depressed because I actually had undiagnosed Aspergers.

This caused me to get bullied, have problems in school which then turned into depression later. People with Aspergers are incredibly sensitive and blind to emotions making them easy targets.

The root cause for me was the Aspergers. What tipped me over the edge was not knowing I was different and being put into a school environment not suited for someone with all the sensitivities associated with Aspergers.

Yes bad things happened to me that made be depressed, but there was more going on.

Re: Depression

#45

Post by ramphastidae »

projektir wrote: post #32
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not affiliated in anyway, just a happy customer. I buy quite a few things from iherb.com, their shipping from California to Tasmania is quite swift, and they sell a brand called Now Foods which seem to consistently have what I want at the best price. Any of the magnesium glycinate, citrate, orotate, here https://www.iherb.com/c/Magnesium should be okay. You just want to avoid magnesium oxide, it's poorly absorbed and…

Mostly I just want what it says on the label to comply with what is in the bottle. So I'm generally not happy with "should be OK", I want "someone tested this and it actually does have this much Magnesium in it specifically".

There is a website called Labdoor which does exactly this.

Re: Depression

#46

Post by naasking »

mthoms wrote: post #29
Waterluvian wrote: post #2

From my amateur perspective, i think the history of how people treat others with depression may be deeply rooted in the Human flaw of, "the way I experience the sensations of existence must be how everyone else does." I can't exactly fault the default response to be, "I don't get it. Just get off your butt and go for a jog. I always feel better when I do that." I remember being so ignorant to depression until I exper…

Exactly my thoughts. Lately I've been using the intoxication metaphor because most people can relate to it. I use it by asking... " Could you explain the feeling of severe intoxication to someone who's never experienced it? " Would they truly understand? Of course not. It's impossible. The same is true of severe depression. Your entire state of mind is altered in a way you have very little control over. It's impossib…

> "Could you explain the feeling of severe intoxication to someone who's never experienced it?" Would they truly understand?

Hm, good thought experiment. My first thought: foggy headed like after getting only a few hours of sleep, but actually feeling generally happy rather than grumpy.

Depression is harder. Take your groggiest, most unmotivated feeling, remove the grogginess and add incredible frustration and helplessness over the fact that you have no reason to feel that way and seemingly no influence on it.

Re: Depression

#47

Post by mthoms »

intralizee wrote: post #40
mthoms wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While this study did find a correlation (unsurprisingly) between depression and childhood trauma. It also found that 1 in 4 sufferers had experienced none at all. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4677006/ Are you suggesting a staggering 25% of depression sufferers have repressed memories? If so, I'd like to point out that there is no scientific consensus that it even exists: From https://en.wikipedia.org/…

I'm not sure how the best way is to respond. Even if the critique suggests "the memories may be false or distorted" the essence still holds properties in how the person has been modified by it. I would still consider the person suffering from trauma associated to it. Trauma from misinterpretation is just as real in comparison to trauma from an event that did in fact happen. Both may result in a person being altered n…

I'm not suggesting "the memories may be false or distorted" and I agree with your sentiment expressed above.

What I'm saying is that your theory - "I believe past trauma is the root cause and I doubt people have depression if they haven't had some type of experience they would classify as trauma" was proven false in the study I cited.

It found that one in four depression sufferers had no childhood trauma to speak of.

Your (apparent?) explanation for this - that 1 in 4 depression suffers have simply suppressed their trauma memories - has no scientific basis.

It all gives the appearance that you're projecting your own personal experience without providing evidence.

Re: Depression

#48

Post by tayo42 »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #34
mabbo wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the one hand, answers like this always seem to over-simplify. Oh hey just take this vitamin and the soul sucking demon that's been riding on your shoulder for years, decades, will magically go away. On the other, I spent nearly two decades of my life suffering from this horrendous illness, and nothing has helped as much as daily magnesium does. I take a big Magnesium pill, a men's health multivitamin and I add D i…

Yeah, on the one hand I'm strongly against drive-by one liners, on the other hand vitamin D cured me . I was already taking magnesium, B6 ... everything else. 8000 to 12000IU of Vitamin D a day for four weeks weeks cured me of my suicidal ideation / depression / emotional instability / irritability. I went to the doctor and got a prescription for antidepressants a couple of times, drove to the pharmacist and sat in t…

did you get tested for having low vitamin d or something? how did you end up deciding to take that much?

Re: Depression

#49

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

tayo42 wrote: post #48
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, on the one hand I'm strongly against drive-by one liners, on the other hand vitamin D cured me . I was already taking magnesium, B6 ... everything else. 8000 to 12000IU of Vitamin D a day for four weeks weeks cured me of my suicidal ideation / depression / emotional instability / irritability. I went to the doctor and got a prescription for antidepressants a couple of times, drove to the pharmacist and sat in t…

did you get tested for having low vitamin d or something? how did you end up deciding to take that much?

I didn’t bother with a test, the symptoms, when I finally connected the dots, were indicative enough for me to give it a go.

It’s not uncommon for doctors around these parts to prescribe pharmastist depended 20,000IU gel caps, after a test of course.

Also, there was an article doing the rounds a few months back indicating we neee way more vitamin D than the current guidelines. I’ll see if I can dig it up.

Edit to add: here we go https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15867918

Re: Depression

#50

Post by intralizee »

mthoms wrote: post #47
intralizee wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure how the best way is to respond. Even if the critique suggests "the memories may be false or distorted" the essence still holds properties in how the person has been modified by it. I would still consider the person suffering from trauma associated to it. Trauma from misinterpretation is just as real in comparison to trauma from an event that did in fact happen. Both may result in a person being altered n…

I'm not suggesting "the memories may be false or distorted" and I agree with your sentiment expressed above. What I'm saying is that your theory - " I believe past trauma is the root cause and I doubt people have depression if they haven't had some type of experience they would classify as trauma " was proven false in the study I cited. It found that one in four depression sufferers had no childhood trauma to speak o…

The study you referenced had the critique I wrote my reply towards.

I don't consider the study proving anything false.

If a person has no childhood trauma to speak of, it can be instilled in the subconscious and they're unable to process it. Psychology is built upon theories with little scientific basis of replicating the assertions. Observation is really all of psychology studies.

Simply, it's difficult or even impossible to provide evidence around problems surrounding the psych by what you're asking. Nobody can assert with science to how conscience is even real.

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