Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water • Hacker News Board

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#111

Post by copperx » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 5:52 AM UTC

8bitsrule wrote: post #104

legohead wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

109 cases in a little over 40 years.. yeah, this is more of a freak occurrence. also, the article says they never tested the water, so this idea of the neti pot is just a guess to begin with.

There must have been something else involved. Should we not swim in pools, rivers or lakes, or submerge ourselves in hot tubs? Netis are part of Ayurvedic medicine in India since long before people dreamed of personal immortality. Remember when people worked outside all summer without worrying about excess UV? Maybe we're overthinking this stuff, we Chicken Little emulators.

Spending a large part of the day under direct sunlight (e.g., working in a farm), is known to paradoxically reduce the risk of skin cancer; whereas occasional exposure (e.g., working at a desk job and then sunbathing in Cancun) greatly increases the risk.

Perhaps we're not overthinking it. Maybe there are complex processes that we don't yet understand.

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#112

Post by copperx » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:00 AM UTC

brianpan wrote: post #81

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #33

I still don't quite understand how tap water in a neti-pot is significantly more dangerous than swimming in local lakes, swimming pool or the ocean. Certainly, you get water in your sinuses from that, right?

You certainly also can get amoeba infections from swimming. https://www.allaboutvision.com/contacts/acanthamoeba-keratit... If you're a contact lens wearer, you should be careful using them while swimming or rinsing them with tap water. A hydrogen peroxide cleaner like Clear Care will help kill amoebas.

I can't find it now, but there was a news story recently where a contact lens wearer contracted something from tap water because she did not dry her hands troughly after washing them and handling the lenses.

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#113

Post by smiley1437 » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:04 AM UTC

dplgk wrote: post #109

chaostheory wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't this company direct you to use their salt packets as well?

Does the salt kill amoebas?

Using a normal saline solution of 0.9% NaCl is much more comfortable, doesn't sting the sinus membranes at all. I wouldn't count on it to kill anything

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#114

Post by tomhoward » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:29 AM UTC

DougN7 wrote: post #110

capkutay wrote: post #2

Sounds like she was using a neti-pot. I thought most of the neti-pot products made it pretty clear that you're supposed to use previously boiled or distilled bottled water. Maybe they need to make it more clear that the consequences of using tap water can be pretty dangerous.

How is a neti pot worse than steam in the shower? I’m surprised at this.

By definition, steam has been heated to a high temperature and exists as stray molecules before condensing back to water droplets. I guess microbes can't easily survive or be carried along in this process.

That said, it seems it's possible that this kind of thing can happen [1], but it's rare (and though that article is confusingly written, it seems that the bacteria in that case came from the air, after the steam had re-formed as water droplets).

Anyway, the OP says this amoeba in a neti-pot scenario is rare too, so it seems we're always talking about fringe cases with this kind of stuff.

[1] http://www.cleveland19.com/story/33829012/doctors-warn-about...

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#115

Post by burtonator » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:30 AM UTC

capkutay wrote: post #2

Sounds like she was using a neti-pot. I thought most of the neti-pot products made it pretty clear that you're supposed to use previously boiled or distilled bottled water. Maybe they need to make it more clear that the consequences of using tap water can be pretty dangerous.

How's this for a disclaimer:

"There's almost no potential upside and a massive potential downside."

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#116

Post by gammateam » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:33 AM UTC

chipperyman573 wrote: post #100

tj-teej wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this is really darwinism at work That is cruel, disgusting and frankly a misrepresentation of Darwinism.

I'm sorry, why do you think so? I'm not saying she deserved to die (in an ethical sense) or that I'm happy she's dead - quite the opposite, a death is never a happy thing for anyone involved and I'm sure this woman is no exception. What I'm trying to get at is, if someone uses a medical appliance in a way that is stated very clearly to potentially cause risks, and then they die as a direct result of this improper usa…

And the idea that someone dying past the age of reproducing by definition cant be darwinism

Also there is no level of fitness that would have prevented this

You get one mistake for your mortality

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#117

Post by nitwit005 » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:34 AM UTC

angry_octet wrote: post #59

I'm stunned at how many people are commenting that they will continue using untreated water. You can end up having your brain eaten and die, I can't think of a PSA any more convincing.

Are you going to stop bathing or showering in untreated water because it might get inside you that way?

We all weigh risk against convenience. This is very low risk.

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#118

Post by MertsA » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 6:46 AM UTC

deepsun wrote: post #94

shawnz wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You shouldn't be using water from the hot tap even just for drinking or cooking, let alone putting in a neti pot. Water from a hot water tank can contain high levels of dissolved contaminants since it sits in your plumbing system for extended periods at high temperatures.

Huh? If tap water is contaminated (by, say, metals or salts from plumbing system pipes), then boiling won't decontaminate it either.

This is what is in your hot water tank right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAzKts6Wp1Q&t=55s

If your water heater is malfunctioning and not heating up all the way to 140 degrees but it's still heating up to e.g. 100 degrees then it's a breeding ground for listeria. The temperature difference changes the solubility of minerals and salts dissolved in it as well as changing how quickly everything even slightly volatile leaches into the water.

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#119

Post by tempestn » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 7:01 AM UTC

cortesoft wrote: post #44

ern wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience using saline nasal flushes, having the water at room temperature hasn't really bothered me, as long as I've added the salt.

Someone else responded to my question saying the same thing. I tried using distilled water at room temperature (with the salt) and it REALLY hurt my nose. Feels great when the water is luke-warm. Maybe I am the only one.

I'm sure you're not. For me it's uncomfortable but bearable at room temperature. Much more comfortable after 12s or so in the microwave.

Re: Rare brain-eating amoebas killed woman who rinsed her sinuses with tap water

#120

Post by tempestn » Sat, Dec 15, 2018, 7:05 AM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #84

glassesman wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neti pots and nasal rinse methods in general have become fairly popular. If reporting on this could save other people from becoming victims, it's worth covering.

Sounds like the easiest way to avoid becoming a victim is not to use the product.

Yes, except then you would be forgoing the benefits, which are significant for situations like sinus infections or colds. Instead, you could simply avoid using it with untreated well water.