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Does it matter where you go to college?

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Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#41

Post by peterburkimsher »

I think "where" you study matters, but for a different reason. It's not the prestige of the school, it's the geographic proximity to potential jobs.

I'm (still) trying to find a job in New Zealand, Australia, or Canada. Despite an MEng and 4 years work experience to satisfy immigration, companies aren't interested in interviewing people who aren't already physically there and have the right to work.

The only solution seems to be to get a student visa by joining a course in underwater basket weaving, and continue looking for a job locally when physically present. It's a terrible misuse of the visa system, but there seems to be no other way.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#42

Post by bosie »

aantix wrote: post #37
devilmoon wrote: post #35

It matters especially if you're not from the US. You could've gone to the best university in your country, but if it's not a top institution in the US or a handful of others (ETH and a few more in top positions according to Qs Rankings) I feel like most big names in tech won't even look at your resume. Anedoctal example, but I graduated with a decent mark from the top CS department in my country (106/110) as an UG, I…

You could have a Github portfolio that has one or two personal projects that demonstrates a proficiency in the language/framework needed at the company you're applying? I've interviewed plenty of people in SF - candidates from top tier universities like MIT. And have passed on them. They simply lacked a proficiency in doing the basics (Rails in this case). There's so many opportunity to be had by just showing very sp…

OP specifically talked about bigger companies:

> I feel like most big names in tech won't even look at your resume.

Do you think your suggestions work for Facebook or Google (which i assume OP means by "big names", among others)?

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#43

Post by kaitai »

CompelTechnic wrote: post #10
thrwthrw93223 wrote: post #5

There is a lot of talk about elite universities offering full-tuition to those that make under a certain income, but what this ignores is usually you have to be in a certain income bracket to obtain certain SAT, AP scores along with the right ECs and upper division college prep courses. This usually means attending the best private, public, or STEM magnent school in your state, which sadly most families in those inco…

It is not mandatory to be in a certain income bracket to get a high score on your SAT or on your AP exams. If the universities want to help low income students, and are only able to help a certain number of them given the resources they have available, academic merit is the best way to do it.

I worked at a small liberal arts college for a few years that basically admitted (1) legacy students, (2) rich kids, (3) sports kids from the South (from states with no D3 football, basically), and (4) poor kids who got high SAT scores. They used (1) for history, (1) and (2) for revenue, (3) for school spirit, and (4) to boost the average SAT for the whole student body.

So many schools are doing exactly what you suggest. It is kind of weird to teach there & realize pretty quickly that the rich kids are mostly not the smart ones, to be blunt.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#44

Post by kaitai »

randyrand wrote: post #22
thrwthrw93223 wrote: post #5

There is a lot of talk about elite universities offering full-tuition to those that make under a certain income, but what this ignores is usually you have to be in a certain income bracket to obtain certain SAT, AP scores along with the right ECs and upper division college prep courses. This usually means attending the best private, public, or STEM magnent school in your state, which sadly most families in those inco…

> have to be in a certain income bracket Have to be? Or tend to be. I think we often overlook that richer families tend to have a lot better parenting. It's not just about money. Good parenting is arguably more important than being wealthy.

Richer families can outsource the parts of parenting they're crappy at.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#45

Post by kaitai »

basseq wrote: post #6

So it's a tautology. Prestigious schools attract top talent because top talent goes to prestigious schools. The best way to be successful is to be top talent—regardless of where you go to school for the majority—but top talent are likely to be those people who push and stress and play to win the "collegiate sweepstakes".

Disagree, because the article/studies essentially indicate that if you're (for instance) a black female who got into MIT but chose to go to State U for cost reasons you'll see an incredible hit in terms of career progression and future earnings. It argues that if you're poor, a racial minority, or female you should go to the top school you can manage even if it causes temporary debt because the payoff will be large. If you're well off and white and a guy you might as well save on college costs, as the career and earning gains are marginal.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#46

Post by kaitai »

cozzyd wrote: post #18

This is not what these studies measure, but people in Academia are much more likely to have gone to elite grad schools (in their respective fields, which is not the same as undergrad rankings of course). And, in my experience (Stanford undergrad, MIT PhD, currently UChicago postdoc), elite grad schools predominantly select people from elite undergrad institutions. It's possible to get into a great grad program from a…

Interestingly there are significant differences across fields, and the data do indicate that this effect in mathematics, for instance, is much smaller than in the humanities.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#47

Post by devilmoon »

bosie wrote: post #42
aantix wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could have a Github portfolio that has one or two personal projects that demonstrates a proficiency in the language/framework needed at the company you're applying? I've interviewed plenty of people in SF - candidates from top tier universities like MIT. And have passed on them. They simply lacked a proficiency in doing the basics (Rails in this case). There's so many opportunity to be had by just showing very sp…

OP specifically talked about bigger companies: > I feel like most big names in tech won't even look at your resume. Do you think your suggestions work for Facebook or Google (which i assume OP means by "big names", among others)?

I did mean FAANG companies, yeah. At the same time I feel what s/he's saying is also right; in fact I am slowly building up repos on github while I work on my masters and hopefully I'll start contributing to librabries I use so that I can show all of that off to potential employers. I also feel like having a website in your name works wonders, but I am not too sure companies are really interested in that.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#48

Post by raptorfactor »

devilmoon wrote: post #35

It matters especially if you're not from the US. You could've gone to the best university in your country, but if it's not a top institution in the US or a handful of others (ETH and a few more in top positions according to Qs Rankings) I feel like most big names in tech won't even look at your resume. Anedoctal example, but I graduated with a decent mark from the top CS department in my country (106/110) as an UG, I…

I'm an Australian with no degree who got poor marks in high school, and I got a job at Microsoft (software engineer doing C++ dev and some light reverse-engineering) after about 5 years of freelance work, with zero qualifications.

IIRC my education history came up once in the interview process (I was interviewed by 6 different people that day and only one brought it up), and that part of the conversation basically consisted of:

Interviewer: "You don't have a degree?"

Me: "No, I'm self-taught."

Interviewer: "Oh okay, that's cool."

Literally nobody that I work with talks or cares about where you went to school or what your grades were. YMMV I guess.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#49

Post by alarge »

commandlinefan wrote: post #3

I think that we idealize that it doesn't matter, but at a certain level, it does matter - even decades later. I went to no-name university and graduated with a high GPA in CS in '95. My work experience since has been solid, and I have some respectable accomplishments, but places like Google and Facebook don't even notice me. The only "black mark" on my resume that I can imagine would be holding me back is "graduated…

Counter-example: I went to a state university, graduating with a degree in Computer Engineering in '89. I've had a number of jobs over the years - several startups, but also roles at Sun Microsystems, Yahoo!, and (currently) Google. While I don't feel like my choice of university has ever particularly helped me, it also hasn't (that I'm aware) hurt me - I've never gotten an inkling that I was passed over for a role because I didn't go to a top-tier school.

Re: Does it matter where you go to college?

#50

Post by kamarg »

devilmoon wrote: post #47
bosie wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP specifically talked about bigger companies: > I feel like most big names in tech won't even look at your resume. Do you think your suggestions work for Facebook or Google (which i assume OP means by "big names", among others)?

I did mean FAANG companies, yeah. At the same time I feel what s/he's saying is also right; in fact I am slowly building up repos on github while I work on my masters and hopefully I'll start contributing to librabries I use so that I can show all of that off to potential employers. I also feel like having a website in your name works wonders, but I am not too sure companies are really interested in that.

I can't speak for the "big names" but as someone who has done tech hiring for multiple SMBs, having a website that shows off your abilities absolutely makes a difference. I don't care if you hand coded the website or it's a bunch of articles on Medium. Showing that you know what you're talking about and can explain it well in English (or the company's language of choice), puts you at the top of my list of people I want to bring in to talk to. It's also likely to make me skip the stupid first steps that most companies take to filter out candidates that have no business applying like fizzbuzz tests when I'm talking to you.
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