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Firefox 64 Released

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Re: Firefox 64 Released

#371

Post by zapzupnz »

bastawhiz wrote: post #369
zapzupnz wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that WebKit recently added "Dark Mode" support, it would likely be sufficient for Firefox to do the same and simply recolour the scrollbar itself, rather than trusting CSS artists to do it sanely and properly.

You're assuming the only scrollbar is on the far right-hand side of the screen. There are plenty of inline scroll bars and scrollbars in parts of the UI that are not adjacent to "native" chrome. Always using the OS default does not make for a good experience.

I don’t see in anything I wrote any implication that I assumed anything about what scroll bars needed or would be themed.

A browser-wide scrollbar styling system, able to be opted into by use of particular CSS, doesn’t imply anything about whether we are talking about just one scroll bar or all of them.

I also disagree about native controls not always being the best solution when it comes to scrolling. We all know how annoying it is when a page jacks scrolling; it’s a usability nightmare that makes pages’ scroll behaviour harder to predict. We don’t need to add to the usability issues by letting one of the most fundamental pieces of chrome in a web browser get jacked even further than the already impermissible state.

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#372

Post by Koshkin »

kgwxd wrote: post #130
jjordan wrote: post #15

Is this the version that kills Live Bookmarks? Some of us FF old-timers are hopelessly reliant on these things, and it's, as far as I have found, the fastest way to quickly scan lists of headlines from all your favorite sites at once. Seriously, one click and you can quickly mouse over the sites on your bookmarks toolbar to consume hundreds of headlines. I really, REALLY hate that they're killing this feature, but th…

Whats wrong with just using a proper RSS client?

A web browser today is essentially an Internet-facing client-side operating system. You are suggesting to use something that runs outside this OS. (Just pointing out.)

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#373

Post by reubenmorais »

zeveb wrote: post #331
Paul-ish wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The addon was abandoned by its author because Mozilla was making major changes to the addon API at the time. Extensions used to have carte blanche to change the browser, which was a security risk, not to mention it made threading/parallelizing the browser hard. The new extension API removed a lot of that freedom. After the API change, it wasn't possible (and might still not be) to develop a useful tab groups addon wi…

> Extensions used to have carte blanche to change the browser, which was a security risk … I don't buy that. It's my browser running on my computer, it's my choice whose code I choose to run on it. If, say, emacs or vi had this kind of handholding, neither one would be much more than a text editor.

Emacs and vi are used by programmers. Browsers are used by nearly every single person on the Internet. The threat model is completely different.

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#374

Post by lightedman »

baroffoos wrote: post #368
lugg wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's called usability through famiarity. Customising UI elements is a usability antipattern. Per [1], predictability and familiarity are key in creating usable interfaces. Making things look nice "because you can" doesn't necessarily mean you should. > When designing your interface, try to be consistent and predictable in your choice of interface elements. Whether they are aware of it or not, users have become famili…

Have you ever seen a game built entirely out of default OS windows and buttons? If you are building an accounting program, sure use all the defaults but if you are building a piece of art I think you can afford to change a scrollbar.

"Have you ever seen a game built entirely out of default OS windows and buttons?"

Castle of the Winds, Windows 3.11.

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#375

Post by stcredzero »

kevincrane wrote: post #120

> We’re excited to introduce multiple tab selection, which makes it easier to manage windows with many open tabs. Simply hold Control (Windows, Linux) or Command (macOS) and click on tabs to select them. Once selected, click and drag to move the tabs as a group — either within a given window, or out into a new window. Yessss. It doesn't happen often, but the times when I open up 6-10 tabs for research but then decide…

I used to use OneTab, but it wasn't robustly constructed to deal with data loss/recovery. I've now moved on to Session Buddy, which has some really nice features, like auto-saving your browsing sessions without your doing anything. (I guess I should check if that respects private modes.)

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#376

Post by mrob »

baroffoos wrote: post #368
lugg wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's called usability through famiarity. Customising UI elements is a usability antipattern. Per [1], predictability and familiarity are key in creating usable interfaces. Making things look nice "because you can" doesn't necessarily mean you should. > When designing your interface, try to be consistent and predictable in your choice of interface elements. Whether they are aware of it or not, users have become famili…

Have you ever seen a game built entirely out of default OS windows and buttons? If you are building an accounting program, sure use all the defaults but if you are building a piece of art I think you can afford to change a scrollbar.

>Have you ever seen a game built entirely out of default OS windows and buttons?

I remember having a lot of fun playing Stars! as a child: https://www.mobygames.com/game/stars

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#377

Post by stcredzero »

floatboth wrote: post #253
sprash wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience X11 has zero shortcomings compared to Wayland. The code might be ancient and arcane at some points but the performance and features (hello "ssh -X") are actually far superior. Why do we need Wayland?

Superior performance? Like when windows take a whole second to appear because the protocol is synchronous and the server is busy doing something else? :) Wayland makes lots of things possible: multi-monitor HiDPI, touchpad gestures like pinch to zoom (just like Macs could do ages ago), touchscreen support that's actually independent of the mouse pointer instead of always dragging it along… and there's finally no godd…

Every frame is perfect™

Every frame is great. If a frame is missing, ### gets quite irate.

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#378

Post by Ar-Curunir »

zeveb wrote: post #331
Paul-ish wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The addon was abandoned by its author because Mozilla was making major changes to the addon API at the time. Extensions used to have carte blanche to change the browser, which was a security risk, not to mention it made threading/parallelizing the browser hard. The new extension API removed a lot of that freedom. After the API change, it wasn't possible (and might still not be) to develop a useful tab groups addon wi…

> Extensions used to have carte blanche to change the browser, which was a security risk … I don't buy that. It's my browser running on my computer, it's my choice whose code I choose to run on it. If, say, emacs or vi had this kind of handholding, neither one would be much more than a text editor.

Emacs or vi don't handle potentially malicious third-party code...

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#379

Post by Ar-Curunir »

sprash wrote: post #203
mixmastamyk wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm happy someone is using it however, as that will encourage many shortcomings to be addressed.

In my experience X11 has zero shortcomings compared to Wayland. The code might be ancient and arcane at some points but the performance and features (hello "ssh -X") are actually far superior. Why do we need Wayland?

X11 doesn't easily support multiple monitors at different DPI, which is almost essential when using a hiRes laptop with an external (also hiRes) monitor.

Re: Firefox 64 Released

#380

Post by kettlecorn »

zeotroph wrote: post #137
Doctor_Fegg wrote: post #22

> The CSS Scrollbars Level 1 spec standardizes features for setting scrollbar width and color I would like these features to be standardised to hands-off-my-fricking-scrollbars. I’m fed up with impossible-to-grab 1px-wide scrollbars because “everyone has trackpads”. No, they don’t.

> Scrollbar One thing I like about the Firefox (Gtk?) scrollbar is that it finally removed (a few version ago already) the "Click on it somewhere, but it doesn't move there but just acts like PgDown/Up", i.e. the non-warping to the exact click position but just inching towards it. This is completely unnecessary in the time of wheels and touchpads and I already miss it everywhere else.

On Windows another lovely scrollbar "feature" is that if you move the mouse too far left while dragging the scrollbar the scrollbar will jump back to where it started.

A handful of people love it, most think it's a bug. It's particularly bad if you're using a trackpad.

I would theorize that it's not a well known complaint because most people move on quickly and just assume their computer is buggy.

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