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Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

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Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#171

Post by Fargren »

jcelerier wrote: post #160
Fargren wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most of the people replying to you are equating "not worrying about finances" with "not working another day in my life". Which is probably which strikes you as disconnected. I see where you are coming from, and agree with you. I am happy to say I'm at a point in my life where I feel I will never have to worry about finances, and I'm nowhere near $10MM. I'm 30 years old, live alone in an apartment that could b…

> I am happy to say I'm at a point in my life where I feel I will never have to worry about finances, if you weren't worrying about finances at some level why are you going to work today instead of going on holidays in a nice spot ? could you handle, say, your house burning overnight with all your belongings ? Never means never , not "comfortable enough to turn a blind eye to the potential problems that may come some…

>if you weren't worrying about finances at some level why are you going to work today instead of going on holidays in a nice spot ?

I care about my finances. But I don't worry about them. I have a high degree of certainty that, barring getting a disease that prevents me from working for multiple years, I won't have major financial problems for the rest of my life. The fact that I live in a country with good public healthcare (Spain) is a factor here.

>? could you handle, say, your house burning overnight with all your belongings ?

100% yes. My belongings are worth less than $10k. It would be annoying, but completely manageable.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#172

Post by 10122018 »

murukesh_s wrote: post #167
10122018 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in the $10-30 million range you can live a comfortable life without having to worry about finances again This statement strikes me as very disconnected from the reality that the vast majority of people on this planet live in, and honestly, a little bit irritating. I'm well aware that many here on HN would be millionaires, but as somebody who grew up in poverty and is now a full-time uni student with no savings in t…

I feel you are having this thought process because you are still a student where you can afford to live frugally. Once you get a job, your social status get raised and you would need 100k a year to live comfortably. So even $1MN is not going to take you far if you stop working, i would even suggest $10MN is also a risky bet, unless you invest it wisely as inflation can easily wipe out a large chunk of that value in f…

> i would even suggest $10MN is also a risky bet

If you had to guess, what percentage of people outside HN, outside Silicon Valley, do you think would consider having $10M to be a risky bet? I'm sorry, but I believe that is very, very disconnected from the reality that most people live in.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#173

Post by murukesh_s »

kaybe wrote: post #140
hueving wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FFS that $10m figure isn't about being comfortable. It's about never having to work again and never having to be concerned about paying for things in an upper middle class lifestyle. You might be happy as a PhD student, but your housing and life is entirely dependent on the university. You are one academic violation away from that all being in jeopardy. What happens if you get a spouse and child? Will your current ho…

Y'know, that's what I like about the European social security systems (not all of them of course, but some). It's just that, security. You can be sure you will have healthcare, you will have housing and you will have food, and so will all your dependents. (Ah and of course you will have to fill out a lot of papers and they will bug you to find a job, and your level of living will be at university student level, but s…

Agreed. I think it's a very good to have a social security to back you. In place where I live very few percentage of people who go for govt. jobs are lucky to get pension directly from the govt., which is always adjusted for inflation so you can have a comfortable life. People outside of that social security are constantly worried and in pursuit of having a decent retirement income option. Wish a system like in Europe becomes a norm in other parts of the world too, though sometimes I feel it can make people lazy, but why are we working so hard for anyways!.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#174

Post by badpun »

sytelus wrote: post #22

TLDR; Michael Norton did the survey of people with networth > $1M and most said they need 2 or 3 times more. People with networth > $100M also don't feel satisfied because they tend to answer the question "Am I better off than last year?" by comparing to other folks who did even better than them. It looks to me that if you are in $3M to $10M bucket, you have financial freedom to live low key upper-middle class life.…

This read a lot like an Onion satire, I sincerely hope that only a handful minority of people would be susceptible to such wants inflation. These wants honestly sound like desperate ways to distract yourself with toys and experiences until you die.

Also, your analysis on having maximum freedom of will at $3B is flawed in that money can only buy so much. For example, you can be the world's wealthiest man but that won't buy you healthy body, good looks or a charitable personality.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#175

Post by edanm »

Applejinx wrote: post #125
JamesBarney wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If somebody were to give me a hundred thousand dollars to invest, I am quite certain I could live comfortably for the rest of my life This shows a pretty big disconnect. And is something no one in their 30s+ would say. The common rule of thumb is you can live off of an investment at 4% indefinitely(assuming 6% return and 2% inflation). This gives you $4,000 a year. Crappy insurance: $4,200 a year. Crappy 300 sq ft…

This seems like a hidden assumption. Why would you not work doing whatever it is you do as an avocation, or if you like, a hobby or dream job? If it's what you love and what fascinates you, why would that not lead to income across your whole life? Granted, it'd take years to get to the point where it's sustainable, but surely there is tangible value in this? I do not understand a mindset of 'My only purpose is to ama…

> I do not understand a mindset of 'My only purpose is to amass a pile of wealth so large that I don't spend any of it or do anything else ever, merely use the mechanisms of finance to subsist unproductively off the leakage from my giant pile of wealth, literally forever'.

> You're going to die having made no use of the hoard you seized, despite having taken it from others who need wealth of their own to survive. Rethink these assumptions.

I would encourage you to rethink your assumptions. What you wrote goes completely against how economics actually works.

You are not "seizing" a hoard, and definitely not taking it from others. Unless you are literally a thief, that's just not how things work - you are making it seem like the economy is zero-sum, whereas it absolutely is not.

Also, having a pile of wealth that you don't spend is something that no one actually does - almost everyone invests their money, which means it is put to good use, as an investment - the wealth that someone created out of thin air, is turned into the building blocks for new people to create their own wealth.

I highly recommend you read a little about economics, it's one of the most rewarding and eye-opening things I've ever studied (only as an amateur, I'm not a professional economist or anything.)

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#176

Post by 10122018 »

Fargren wrote: post #171
jcelerier wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am happy to say I'm at a point in my life where I feel I will never have to worry about finances, if you weren't worrying about finances at some level why are you going to work today instead of going on holidays in a nice spot ? could you handle, say, your house burning overnight with all your belongings ? Never means never , not "comfortable enough to turn a blind eye to the potential problems that may come some…

>if you weren't worrying about finances at some level why are you going to work today instead of going on holidays in a nice spot ? I care about my finances. But I don't worry about them. I have a high degree of certainty that, barring getting a disease that prevents me from working for multiple years, I won't have major financial problems for the rest of my life. The fact that I live in a country with good public he…

> I care about my finances. But I don't worry about them.

I think that is the key to understanding much of the disagreement here. Some people seem to concentrate on the possibility that something catastrophic could happen, which admittedly, is true. But I think it's possible to be comfortable in life, with that risk. Most people don't have a choice but to bear that risk, and many would still, I believe, describe themselves as happy and comfortable.

I think by "comfortable", some people mean "immune to any possible threat", in which case, I begin to understand their point of view.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#177

Post by eertami »

murukesh_s wrote: post #167
10122018 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in the $10-30 million range you can live a comfortable life without having to worry about finances again This statement strikes me as very disconnected from the reality that the vast majority of people on this planet live in, and honestly, a little bit irritating. I'm well aware that many here on HN would be millionaires, but as somebody who grew up in poverty and is now a full-time uni student with no savings in t…

I feel you are having this thought process because you are still a student where you can afford to live frugally. Once you get a job, your social status get raised and you would need 100k a year to live comfortably. So even $1MN is not going to take you far if you stop working, i would even suggest $10MN is also a risky bet, unless you invest it wisely as inflation can easily wipe out a large chunk of that value in f…

>your social status get raised and you would need 100k a year to live comfortably

Haha come on. You know that is not true. I live a pretty good life where I get to move country every few months (in Europe), have expensive hobbies, ski 100+ days a year and after currency conversion make closer to 50k.

For what it's worth, I only work 2 days/week, if I "needed" 100k USD I could go to a full time position but I don't see why I would ever "need" that. Especially if I was choosing to live in 1 location and spend less time on hobbies.

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#178

Post by murukesh_s »

10122018 wrote: post #172
murukesh_s wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel you are having this thought process because you are still a student where you can afford to live frugally. Once you get a job, your social status get raised and you would need 100k a year to live comfortably. So even $1MN is not going to take you far if you stop working, i would even suggest $10MN is also a risky bet, unless you invest it wisely as inflation can easily wipe out a large chunk of that value in f…

> i would even suggest $10MN is also a risky bet If you had to guess, what percentage of people outside HN, outside Silicon Valley, do you think would consider having $10M to be a risky bet? I'm sorry, but I believe that is very, very disconnected from the reality that most people live in.

I was talking from the silicon valley perspective. You need to adjust it based on the country you live in.

I understand you, I have been a student and believe me I lived for few dollars a day (that too in a comfy way) including accommodation and food. When I started a job in 2004, making 200k USD was my dream retirement amount. Now I don't call it would be comfortable with even $10 mn and never having to work again. I would definitely keep working as long as I can even with $10 mn in my bank. It's not that I am greedy and have to constantly go for vacations or stay in 5* places. When you have a partner and kids, you really need to spend that much money to live in the social status that you ends up in your society. Home mortgage, kids school fees, dress, food, family outings and it could easily add up. You are talking about in the range of 10k-200k per year depending on the country/city you live in. In expensive cities where you need 100-200k to live comfortably, $1mn will last you only a few years even with good return on investments adjusted against inflation. It's very unfortunate but it's true. You too shall see that day when you grow up.

btw i just noticed and in case you need any emergency assistance, feel free to ping me, it's not that I am rich, but can help you out in anyway i can - murukesh @

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#179

Post by simonh »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #97
rv-de wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of machine learning money is the opposite of regularization. The more money the less regularization the more over-fitting to your specific self-chosen environment. A not rich person will have to learn to cope with obstacles. A rich person can remove obstacles. But it is impossible to remove all obstacles which will lead to increased hostility towards those remaining annoyances - like for example with SUVs in…

Money is an insanely toxic mental, political, and social poison, for exactly these kinds of reasons. It's also a social reward function that privileges egotism and narcissism over empathy; exploitation, scamming, and rent-seeking over creativity, curiosity and invention; and short-term gain over long-term damage. Like the hardest of hard addictive drugs, it's an almost irresistible modifier of behaviour and attitude.

[flagged]

Re: Why Aren’t Rich People Happy With the Money They Have?

#180

Post by pasta »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #97
rv-de wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of machine learning money is the opposite of regularization. The more money the less regularization the more over-fitting to your specific self-chosen environment. A not rich person will have to learn to cope with obstacles. A rich person can remove obstacles. But it is impossible to remove all obstacles which will lead to increased hostility towards those remaining annoyances - like for example with SUVs in…

Money is an insanely toxic mental, political, and social poison, for exactly these kinds of reasons. It's also a social reward function that privileges egotism and narcissism over empathy; exploitation, scamming, and rent-seeking over creativity, curiosity and invention; and short-term gain over long-term damage. Like the hardest of hard addictive drugs, it's an almost irresistible modifier of behaviour and attitude.

Some 2000 years ago this was already the case.

1 Timothy 6:10: "...the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil."

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