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Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

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Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#31

Post by arh68 »

jpatokal wrote: post #14

Totally unscientific theory: sweeteners are to sugar what methadone is to heroin. If you're using them, you're still craving/addicted to sugar and your palate remains out of whack, so you're probably also drawn to sugary foods that don't use sweeteners (eg. most commercial pasta sauce, ketchup, fruit juice, many breads).

But then why do they consume less fructose overall? It’s plausible but this study seems to suggest the exact opposite.

> ...users consumed lower amounts of fructose and higher amounts of caffeine than non-users, but had similar diet quality.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#32

Post by tapland »

oculusthrift wrote: post #4

Wouldn’t fatter people naturally try to switch over to low calorie sweetener in order to lose weight? whereas non fat people might just enjoy sugar instead?

Yes.

There has been data like this out there for ages.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#33

Post by chineseGoogle »

oculusthrift wrote: post #4

Wouldn’t fatter people naturally try to switch over to low calorie sweetener in order to lose weight? whereas non fat people might just enjoy sugar instead?

I have numerous fat friends that use the calories saved by diet foods as a green light to recover equivalent calories elsewhere.

The fatalist claim being: well, one would've just eaten that much anyway, so what's the difference?

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#34

Post by subcosmos »

nostromo wrote: post #5

This seems incredibly weak because they haven't shown causation -- or, in particular, disproved reverse causation. (That people struggling with weight gain are more likely to use sugar substitutes.) This is more of a "huh, someone should do additional research" paper than anything conclusive.

It was shown over 10 years ago that sweet taste receptors are also expressed in the membranes of fat cells, and that artificial sweeteners activate these receptors in cell culture and drive up lipid storage.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#35

Post by comicjk »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #26

Fat people should probably try lactulose - a zero-calory (indigestible) sweet syrup (somewhat similar to maple syrup) with prebiotic and laxative properties. Besides being tasty it can actually make their guts healthier so their ghrelin (hunger hormone) secretion can decrease and their leptin (fullness hormone) secretion can increase.

Laxative artificial sweeteners have the problem that people don't dose food as carefully as medicine. I'm reminded of the famous Haribo maltitol gummy bears, which when eaten more than about 20 at a time would cause a...powerful laxative effect.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#36

Post by nxc18 »

subcosmos wrote: post #34
nostromo wrote: post #5

This seems incredibly weak because they haven't shown causation -- or, in particular, disproved reverse causation. (That people struggling with weight gain are more likely to use sugar substitutes.) This is more of a "huh, someone should do additional research" paper than anything conclusive.

It was shown over 10 years ago that sweet taste receptors are also expressed in the membranes of fat cells, and that artificial sweeteners activate these receptors in cell culture and drive up lipid storage.

Still doesn't mean anything until you prove it is significant in the end result (sweetener causing weight gain).

I've lost 60 pounds this year drinking huge amounts of diet soda. I've made more progress than when I tried cutting out sweeteners entirely.

There's a whole lot more going on with these issues than cell cultures and it's really counterproductive to pull random science out of a hat and say it proves your point. It only drives distrust in the whole concept of scientific reasoning.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#37

Post by qwerty456127 »

comicjk wrote: post #35
qwerty456127 wrote: post #26

Fat people should probably try lactulose - a zero-calory (indigestible) sweet syrup (somewhat similar to maple syrup) with prebiotic and laxative properties. Besides being tasty it can actually make their guts healthier so their ghrelin (hunger hormone) secretion can decrease and their leptin (fullness hormone) secretion can increase.

Laxative artificial sweeteners have the problem that people don't dose food as carefully as medicine. I'm reminded of the famous Haribo maltitol gummy bears, which when eaten more than about 20 at a time would cause a...powerful laxative effect.

Worth (and fun) mentioning but as for me I don't feel like it's a problem as long as there is a toilet nearby. Lactulose laxative effect is faster to act but not nearly as powerful as e.g. that of bisacodyl. According to my experience (needless to say it may differ in others so be careful) it will hardly cause any serious inconvenience or discomfort any soon after you defecate (a couple of times in a row perhaps) or make you need a toilet really often, especially after you get used to it and your colon adapts and gets generally cleaner and healthier. What I find the most valuable property of lactulose is its prebiotic effect (somewhat similar to that of inulin[1]), it really feels and seems like it makes an amazing difference in the gut ecology.

[1] https://www.startpage.com/do/dsearch?query=lactulose+inulin+...

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#38

Post by dyoo1979 »

Can anyone tell which low calorie sweeteners the study is talking about? Certain artificial sweeteners elicit a large insulin response even if they are "low-calorie". Did they use any of the sweeteners listed in https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/healthy-drinks/...?

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#39

Post by eckza »

jpatokal wrote: post #14

Totally unscientific theory: sweeteners are to sugar what methadone is to heroin. If you're using them, you're still craving/addicted to sugar and your palate remains out of whack, so you're probably also drawn to sugary foods that don't use sweeteners (eg. most commercial pasta sauce, ketchup, fruit juice, many breads).

In my lived, anecdotal experience:

I grew up eating “normal” foods and drinking non-diet soda.

I am an average-sized guy. I fell in love with a sweetheart of a woman that was around 300lbs. I married her. She’s now less than half that.

I eat what she eats. Diet, sugar-free everything. After a few years of tolerating it, I prefer it. Normal soda tastes like cough syrup, to me. Cake and donuts make me nauseated. I don’t crave sugar, at all.

Also, ketchup has a shit ton of sugar in it, for the record. (I know this, because we use sugar-free ketchup.)

Do with this anecdotal informaton what you will; but as someone who has fully transitioned to artificial sweeteners - I can’t say that my lived experience lines up with your claims.

Re: Low-Calorie Sweetener Use and Risk of Abdominal Obesity Among Older Adults

#40

Post by eckza »

chineseGoogle wrote: post #33
oculusthrift wrote: post #4

Wouldn’t fatter people naturally try to switch over to low calorie sweetener in order to lose weight? whereas non fat people might just enjoy sugar instead?

I have numerous fat friends that use the calories saved by diet foods as a green light to recover equivalent calories elsewhere. The fatalist claim being: well, one would've just eaten that much anyway, so what's the difference?

This should be the top comment in this thread.
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