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Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

fox2detroit.com

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Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#61

Post by crshstsh »

markdown wrote: post #52
pstuart wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazier still is that kratom is getting lined up to be scheduled as well, when it is a proven safe tool for weaning people off of opiates.

Kratom is great as medicine to wean people off opiates. However, it absolutely shouldn't be used in a recreational setting as it currently is, served in kratom bars (though they like to use the name "Kava" in an attempt to fly under the radar). See /r/quittingkratom

Why would they sell it as Kava when Kratom is more expensive? I am on day 5 of getting off of Kratom. This smy second time around, and the first was horrendous. A couple of months ago a doctor prescribed Gabapentin and I've literally experience only 5% of the side effects of withdrawal. All the intense symptoms disappeared and I glided through this week. I wonder why doctors prescribe Suboxone and Methadone, both highly addictive.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#62

Post by specialist »

akamel wrote: post #10
CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #3

Ugh. I’m going on for surgery next Thursday, for a laparoscopic partial colon resection, and one of the things I’m most worried about will be post-surgery pain killers. Hearing stories about excessive pain killer use and prescription really make me want to avoid them, but on the other hand I’ll need to be up & moving around ASAP to speed my recovery, and pain would get in the way of that.

Use them only when you need them. I was really annoyed when my wife’s doctor freely prescribed her oxi after her delivery even though my wife never asked for it and never showed any sign of needing it. Having free flowing prescriptions is how we end up with so many addicts.

Better to have a 3 day supply on hand just in case vs the mad scramble to get scripts filled afterwards.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#63

Post by specialist »

mgkimsal wrote: post #17
akamel wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Use them only when you need them. I was really annoyed when my wife’s doctor freely prescribed her oxi after her delivery even though my wife never asked for it and never showed any sign of needing it. Having free flowing prescriptions is how we end up with so many addicts.

and then... for legitimate cases... no dice. about 7 years ago my wife got sand in her eye - was problematic enough that we went to a local clinic. she wasn't going to go blind, but it was irritated enough that after flushing it out, it still looked... bad. and she indicated it was a bit sore, that she wanted to get home to just try to get to sleep. The doctor there offered a prescription for percocet. We said "no, n…

I'm sorry for your pain. Back problems are the worst.

Oversteer is the norm. Precautionary principle and all that.

Patients with chronic pain have to train their care givers, just as they have to train you. You're building relationships, trust. Just like dating, jobs. Unhappy or uncomfortable? Move on to others you can work with.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#64

Post by HillaryBriss »

_Nat_ wrote: post #45
HillaryBriss wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

interesting that only about $10 million was fraudulently billed to a private company (blue cross/blue shield), and pretty much all the rest was billed to state and federal governments. maybe this is reading too much into it, but might this be evidence that government health care funds are poorly managed and pay out too much, too often, asking too few questions in the process?

What'd be the argument for that interpretation? To note it, the article's figures are for submitted claims, not for approved claims.

true. it may be that they didn't pay out many, or any, of those claims. fair point.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#65

Post by HillaryBriss »

CPLX wrote: post #49
HillaryBriss wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

interesting that only about $10 million was fraudulently billed to a private company (blue cross/blue shield), and pretty much all the rest was billed to state and federal governments. maybe this is reading too much into it, but might this be evidence that government health care funds are poorly managed and pay out too much, too often, asking too few questions in the process?

Or it’s evidence that they exploited a population that doesn’t have private health insurance.

yeah, that seems reasonable. and maybe the patient population in their area is covered almost exclusively by state and federal plans because of low income.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#66

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #51
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The feds could straightforwardly address the fentanyl problem by deillegalizing opiods, allowing reputable distribution to take over. And then society could maturely deal with addiction as a personal medical problem. I don't understand this at all. Most opioids are legal prescription drugs. The problem is that they are highly addictive, so despite trying deal with addition as a "personal medical problem", which is…

>> The feds could straightforwardly address the fentanyl problem by deillegalizing opiods, allowing reputable distribution to take over. > I don't understand this at all. Most opioids are legal prescription drugs. It's pretty straightforward. "Legal prescription drugs" are drugs you're not allowed to have without permission, and doctors face prosecution for giving you permission. This doesn't really promote safe avai…

Yeah, surely the solution to the opioid epidemic is making fentanyl available at CVS.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#67

Post by mindslight »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #66
thaumasiotes wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The feds could straightforwardly address the fentanyl problem by deillegalizing opiods, allowing reputable distribution to take over. > I don't understand this at all. Most opioids are legal prescription drugs. It's pretty straightforward. "Legal prescription drugs" are drugs you're not allowed to have without permission, and doctors face prosecution for giving you permission. This doesn't really promote safe avai…

Yeah, surely the solution to the opioid epidemic is making fentanyl available at CVS.

The current approach doesn't seem to have constrained availability much, so that is baseless hyperbole.

The point is that opiates from a reputable distribution channel wouldn't be laced with fentanyl. Have the state run the stores, appropriate security on duty, set the price just below market level, and use the profits to fund treatment programs. Tie the treatment programs into the retail stores, for immediate feedback for when people deviate. The treatment programs could even do things like accept returns for full refund, so people who are trying to quit aren't tempted to keep a stash laying around.

I doubt most people addicted to opiates actually want to be addicted - an aspect that gets left out of the righteous narrative.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#68

Post by pstuart »

markdown wrote: post #52
pstuart wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazier still is that kratom is getting lined up to be scheduled as well, when it is a proven safe tool for weaning people off of opiates.

Kratom is great as medicine to wean people off opiates. However, it absolutely shouldn't be used in a recreational setting as it currently is, served in kratom bars (though they like to use the name "Kava" in an attempt to fly under the radar). See /r/quittingkratom

Any arguments like this that don't also call for banning alcohol and tobacco are specious at best.

Society has "agreed" that while those substances are dangerous, it is up to the individual to determine how they are consumed.

So this then becomes an argument of "I don't like your vice and I'm going to decide whether or not you can partake".

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#69

Post by newyankee »

pupdogg wrote: post #4

Wow! Now it makes sense how Dr. Rajendra Bothra was well connected in the Indian Bollywood industry. I personally recall big Bollywood stars opting to stay over his house during their US trip instead of a local 5 star hotel...mind you, this was back in late 90s. I hadn't heard of him in a while thinking he might've retired or died. This is a shocker that they're taking him down while in his retirement. Feds do not ki…

It is well known that a lot of Bollywood was bankrolled by the Indian underworld in the 90s. This used to be much more common before the recent (last 10-15 years) which led to more corporate like setups. I am assuming a lot of the underworld folks slowly cleaned some of the stuff. But also very well known that the industry is very incestuous and dynasty oriented at least as far as many actors are concerned. Not the least surprised.

Re: Six Detroit area doctors indicted in $500M health care fraud

#70

Post by JoshuaDavid »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #66
thaumasiotes wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The feds could straightforwardly address the fentanyl problem by deillegalizing opiods, allowing reputable distribution to take over. > I don't understand this at all. Most opioids are legal prescription drugs. It's pretty straightforward. "Legal prescription drugs" are drugs you're not allowed to have without permission, and doctors face prosecution for giving you permission. This doesn't really promote safe avai…

Yeah, surely the solution to the opioid epidemic is making fentanyl available at CVS.

It comes down to the question of whether you think the opioid epidemic is mostly bad because even perfectly safe addiction stops people from living fulfilling / valuable / productive lives, or if it is mostly bad because people are dying from their addiction.

Making fentanyl available at CVS would probably increase the number of people addicted to opioids, but would also vastly reduce the risk of death in those people (due to better quality control and consistent dosage).

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