Lyft Files for IPO • Hacker News Board

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#201

Post by tomp » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:41 PM UTC

rococode wrote: post #175

whoisjuan wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Ride sharing" is not an accurate representation of these companies anymore. Uber and Lyft are trying to become major mobility and transportation platforms. The core of their business right now relies on ride-sharing, but if they want to become sustainable long-term companies they need to evolve their business. Sadly, drivers are just an input to generate cash flow. They're definitely not indispensable, especially wi…

At this point Uber and Lyft are really just taxi companies with nice apps. Add the driver reviews, GPS locations, and requesting a ride via an app to a traditional taxi system and it's the same. The only major advantage they have right now is that Uber/Lyft are standardized throughout cities and suburbs, whereas taxi companies are mostly local to one city.

The other significant advantage is that they're cheaper. Either because they're actually cheaper (e.g. in London, black cab drivers have to train to know every street by heart, whereas Uber drivers can just rely on technology (Google Maps)), or because Uber subsidizes the passengers, but regardless, they're significantly cheaper (speaking for London).

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#202

Post by Itaxpica » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:42 PM UTC

Scoundreller wrote: post #178

reaperducer wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2) Lyft focuses on profitable higher income markets like the US and Canada so they can have a higher margin and not get into pricing wars This, I think, is more important than many people realize. When I was driving for Uber and Lyft (for about eight months, two years ago), Lyft had an entirely different clientele. Uber was for the poors, the frat boys, and the average Joe Lunchbucket. Lyft was a decidedly better cla…

Any idea what drives Lyft riders to be better behaved? Is Lyft more expensive in your locale? I’m in a new Lyft market, so their pricing makes them the cheapest with their discounts often.

Random guess: most of the pople I know who use Lyft do so because they've been put off at one point or another by one or more of Uber's scandals - Uber is widely viewed as the 'default', while Lyft is the more 'moral' option. If this pattern holds true, it means that the Lyft userbase will generally be a group that is A. better informed overall and B. more willing to make purchasing decisions driven by their ethics, which all in all suggests a more thoughtful clientele.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#203

Post by Itaxpica » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:44 PM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #174

benj111 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber takes the flack, gets the law changed, creates the market. Lyft sails in and gets most of the benefits, without those costs. Uber doesn't have a massive moat. Drivers can have both apps, users can have both apps. You attract drivers by paying them more, you attract riders by charging them less. Uber for now can afford to beat everyone on both those fronts, but eventually they will have to start making a profit.…

Uber for now can afford to beat everyone on both those fronts As someone who drove for both platforms, this is not true. Lyft pays drivers more than Uber in the market I was driving in. Most drivers would abandon Uber in a heartbeat if Lyft just had more users. The problem was that for every Lyft request that came in, you'd get 10 to 20 Uber requests.

A big reason I switched to Lyft was hearing consistently from drivers that they preferred it. This has the added bonus effect of meaning that wait times for Lyft are way lower than Uber on average IME, since drivers are more likely to pick up a Lyft fare.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#204

Post by jazzkingrt » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:48 PM UTC

pmart123 wrote: post #195

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Southwest Airlines for a long time just focused on point-to-point flights, avoiding money-losing flight patterns that routed passengers through a Chicago to New York type connection. Additionally, SWA only maintained 737's, and free checked baggage allowed for faster onboarding and deplaning, and therefore, faster turnaround times. Eventually, this little airline became the largest airline after the major airlines bo…

What a great example! I'm realizing that perhaps the "second mover advantage" may be more pronounced in markets with low switching costs. Flyers can easily compare airline prices against one another, and drivers are incentivized to boot up 2nd, 3rd and 4th driving apps. Low-margin businesses can't afford to spend as much on R&D, make mistakes, etc. They have to win with small executional advantages.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#205

Post by uptownfunk » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:55 PM UTC

Except Uber still works.. fastest tap to ride time I’ve seen across all the apps.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#206

Post by nine_k » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:55 PM UTC

Scoundreller wrote: post #178

reaperducer wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2) Lyft focuses on profitable higher income markets like the US and Canada so they can have a higher margin and not get into pricing wars This, I think, is more important than many people realize. When I was driving for Uber and Lyft (for about eight months, two years ago), Lyft had an entirely different clientele. Uber was for the poors, the frat boys, and the average Joe Lunchbucket. Lyft was a decidedly better cla…

Any idea what drives Lyft riders to be better behaved? Is Lyft more expensive in your locale? I’m in a new Lyft market, so their pricing makes them the cheapest with their discounts often.

Lyft's fare is predictable, and rises little even at peak hours. The fares are mostly in the same ballpark as Uber's.

Lyft's Android app just works, and is reasonably usable. I've been burned by Uber's app crashing after an update.

I keep using Lyft over Uber; most drivers I see in my area (NYC and Brooklyn) have both apps installed. But many seem to have the Lyft-specific sign under the windhshield, but rarely an explicit Uber sign.

As a corporation, Lyft seems to be much less showy, and does not seem to be losing gargantuan sums on pie-in-the-sky projects. They project a nicer, if understated, image; this is also somehow attractive, and likely says something about the way the company is run.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#207

Post by katzgrau » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 9:56 PM UTC

pmart123 wrote: post #195

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Southwest Airlines for a long time just focused on point-to-point flights, avoiding money-losing flight patterns that routed passengers through a Chicago to New York type connection. Additionally, SWA only maintained 737's, and free checked baggage allowed for faster onboarding and deplaning, and therefore, faster turnaround times. Eventually, this little airline became the largest airline after the major airlines bo…

Completely agreed. There's always a second-mover advantage for burgeoning industries in that second-movers can avoid the mistakes that the first movers have become entrenched in.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#208

Post by nine_k » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 10:05 PM UTC

CPLX wrote: post #171

cartsagis wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The future of ridesharing is uber pool/lyft line in order to increase efficiency. The network effect is huge.

Have you ever, like, actually used the shared ride options? It can be handy when you're not in a hurry, but as long as people are involved, and they aren't always where they say they are going to be, there's a pretty hard upper limit to how efficient things can get.

A shared car is great when you have little money, few other options of transportation, and the route allows to share it with other people.

I did it a few times. But usually when I need a ride, it's because I'm in a hurry, and paying $5 more is no object. Else mass transit suffices. This only works in urban areas, but it's where the most profitable ride-hailing markets seem to be anyway.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#209

Post by ghaff » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 10:10 PM UTC

katzgrau wrote: post #207

pmart123 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Southwest Airlines for a long time just focused on point-to-point flights, avoiding money-losing flight patterns that routed passengers through a Chicago to New York type connection. Additionally, SWA only maintained 737's, and free checked baggage allowed for faster onboarding and deplaning, and therefore, faster turnaround times. Eventually, this little airline became the largest airline after the major airlines bo…

Completely agreed. There's always a second-mover advantage for burgeoning industries in that second-movers can avoid the mistakes that the first movers have become entrenched in.

Lyft has gone through quite a few iterations of its own. Predecessors started before Uber but, even more recently, it moved beyond the pink mustache and fist bumping into being essentially an Uber clone. I (and apparently others) found the whole "be buddies with your driver" thing to actually be a real turn-off.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#210

Post by pnathan » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 10:16 PM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #170

hunter23 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can guess few of their story points (hard to know until they release their numbers): 1) The market can support multiple players running profitable (i.e it's a 2 player or 3 player market). Think of the drugstore industry (Walgreens & CVS). 2) Lyft focuses on profitable higher income markets like the US and Canada so they can have a higher margin and not get into pricing wars with massive foreign players (Didi, Oola…

2) Lyft focuses on profitable higher income markets like the US and Canada so they can have a higher margin and not get into pricing wars This, I think, is more important than many people realize. When I was driving for Uber and Lyft (for about eight months, two years ago), Lyft had an entirely different clientele. Uber was for the poors, the frat boys, and the average Joe Lunchbucket. Lyft was a decidedly better cla…

Talking with a Lyft driver near Seattle the other day who drives for both, his perception was that Lyft was for weekday riders, Uber for weekend riders.