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A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

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Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#63

Post by rococode »

csbrooks wrote: post #49
talltimtom wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“all the shady stuff ... things like put it on the front page and in the newsletter and whatnot.” I really don’t get how you could consider them helping to promote popular campaigns shady. I mean it’s the very point of the entire platform, and how both they and their users and the backers of projects gain value.

All the stuff he describes after that does sound really shady to me, though. Yuck.

Especially the "you can anonymously back yourself for as much as you want". That sounds like fraud to me...

Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#64

Post by jen729w »

CosmicShadow wrote: post #37

Indiegogo in particular is super sketchy, I did a campaign with them and they had an employee there contacting me and telling me all the shady stuff they can do to help me be successful and if that I can guarantee I'll raise x amount they'll do all these extra things like put it on the front page and in the newsletter and whatnot. They let you extend campaigns forever if you arne't about to hit your goal so you can k…

Funnily enough just this morning my inbox has this:

---

From: Indiegogo

Subject: Your Indiegogo Innovation Award

Hi there!

We're excited to inform you that your project is eligible to receive an Indiegogo Innovation Award this January!

To honor your crowdfunding achievements, we cordially invite you to reserve your award, available for pick-up at this year's Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas.

Our theme at this year's CES is "Indiegogo Means Business," and your campaign is proof that creative ideas indeed grow into successful businesses with Indiegogo. As only 100 entrepreneurs will receive this gift, we hope you enjoy it as much as the Indiegogo community has enjoyed your ingenious ideas.

Thank you for being a pivotal part of Indiegogo!

---

I have never run a campaign on Indiegogo.

Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#67

Post by robertpohl »

Help me understand why the consumer protection is not used here?

In order to do card payments the merchant (IGG) need to be able to refund. It they cannot, the acquirer must do so. Anyways, one of the purposes of Visa and MasterCard is protection from these scams. If you don't get 100% of what you bought, you can get refunded by the card issuer, which will collect acquirer/merchant.

Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#68

Post by FullyFunctional »

joshstrange wrote: post #43

Never pledge on indiegogo, it's for scammers only. Kickstarter (for all it's warts) requires a working prototype to post on their site. IGG requires no such proof that you aren't selling vaporware. Also IGG shows total pledge numbers from IGG PLUS Kickstarter (and potentially other crowdfunding sites you might post to) so that their numbers look bigger. Stop, Drop, & Retro has some really good YouTube videos calling…

Claiming either is great, but I have been scammed more on KS than Indigogo. Today I super weary of both, but I have and will back projects by people who I know or whose reputation I know though other channels. (OLKB, TinyFPGA, etc).

Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#69

Post by sonnyblarney »

roywiggins wrote: post #50
whatshisface wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will, metaphorically, if a lack of funding will kill the product (or prevent it from ever being made). Crowdfunding is a financing option, complete with the part where the financiers are exposed to risk.

My $100 (or whatever) isn't likely to be the difference between something being funded or not; if it's going to be funded anyway, I might as well let some other guy put up the money, and I'll buy the product when it's available generally. Crowdfunders are exposed to risk, but they aren't going to profit. Real investment comes with the prospect of an actual upside for the investors, but if I can just buy the product l…

"My $100 (or whatever) isn't likely to be the difference between something being funded or not; "

It absolutely will.

I have a very close acquaintaince in the process of doing hardware (and I have experience with this myself).

Getting the first production run is brutally difficult, and the operating captiol requirement just doesn't exist.

VC's don't want to pay for it, and neither do business development banks.

Though I think there is a lot of scamming ... 'hardware is hard'. Really hard.

I actually believe a lot of it is 1/2 way - they raise money with good intentions, but then are just stupid and lazy in getting production up, and then can't afford it. Once a team has 1 million - if they get production up, maybe they get 100K in profit. But if they 'fail' to get production up ... they can keep maybe $700 in 'profit' i.e. what they didn't spend on units.

Maybe a better solution would be to have escrow and pay on delivery, with partial payments or something like that.

Re: A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam

#70

Post by chenster »

robertpohl wrote: post #67

Help me understand why the consumer protection is not used here? In order to do card payments the merchant (IGG) need to be able to refund. It they cannot, the acquirer must do so. Anyways, one of the purposes of Visa and MasterCard is protection from these scams. If you don't get 100% of what you bought, you can get refunded by the card issuer, which will collect acquirer/merchant.

Maybe because the consumers are investing in a future product. It is not the same as buying directly online from ECommerce store like Amazon. Investing implies risk. The consumers can probably still get a refund for fraudulent charges from CC.
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